230 volt hand held power tools

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Tim Keveney

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Location
rudyard, mi
I work for a European machinery manufacturer. We import a hand held power tool which runs on 230 volt 1 ph current.

I have heard that in a place of business, that it is not legal to operate a hand held power tool which runs on voltage greater than 125 volt.

Is this true?

Thanks in advance for your advice on this topic.

TIM
 
iwire

iwire

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Massachusetts
In one of our dwelling units that could be a code violation.

In a business it would be allowed but your potential customers won't have outlets to supply these tools so I think that will kill your sales.
 
peter d

peter d

Senior Member
Location
New England
Tim Keveney said:
I work for a European machinery manufacturer. We import a hand held power tool which runs on 230 volt 1 ph current.

I have heard that in a place of business, that it is not legal to operate a hand held power tool which runs on voltage greater than 125 volt.

Is this true?

Thanks in advance for your advice on this topic.

TIM
Click to expand...

Why would you be importing 230 volt tools when all the world's major tool manufacturers make 120 volt versions of their tools? It's not like they aren't aware of the North American market. It sounds like your company needs to go back to the drawing board. Unless these European tools aren't the traditional power tools I'm thinking of (Bosch, Metabo, Festool, etc)
 
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petersonra

Senior Member
Location
Northern illinois
Occupation
engineer
Tim Keveney said:
I work for a European machinery manufacturer. We import a hand held power tool which runs on 230 volt 1 ph current.

I have heard that in a place of business, that it is not legal to operate a hand held power tool which runs on voltage greater than 125 volt.

Is this true?

Thanks in advance for your advice on this topic.

TIM
Click to expand...

I don't believe that to be true.

They might have to install some 230V outlets, but that is not illegal.

What might be a problem is that our 230V is center tap grounded, rather than one of the lines being grounded.
 
F

fmtjfw

Senior Member
Location
Fairmont, WV, USA
Semi-random thoughts

Semi-random thoughts

Typically hand-held, corded tools use ac/dc rated motors because they have good stall characteristics. It is unlikely that the frequency difference would matter, since the current is commutated at a frequency unrelated to line Hz anyway.

If you just intend to sell them to "households" probably anything goes. [Appliances that say "for household use only" are so labelled because they typically do not meet the requirements for use in a place of business.] If you intend to sell them to the construction industry, you may a problem as all temporary circuits must be GFCI-protected and this is usually done with GFCI-receptacles which normally don't come in 240V. Further 240V extension cords are rare. And finally CE listings are not sufficient.

[Doesn't the UK use 120V, center-grounded (like our technical circuits) for construction.]

As to whether or not there is an identified neutral depends on the country and plug -- NO DE; YES UK, FR: others ??

I think most corded hand-held power tools in the US are now double insulated. (2 wire, unpolarized plugs)
 
Jraef

Jraef

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banditdfw said:
You may also have an issue with frequency (50hz vs. 60hz)
Click to expand...
Most hand-held power tools will have "Universal" motors, which are AC/DC but actually more DC that you can apply AC to. So they are not going to be frequency sensitive.

It's the 230V only that will be the market killer. As others have said, they need to go back to the drawing board if they want to sell them here. Virtually ALL other portable power tool suppliers have done that.
 
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GoldDigger

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Location
Placerville, CA, USA
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Retired PV System Designer
petersonra said:
and just how could that possibly be enforced for a portable tool?
Click to expand...

By rejecting the receptacle unless the usage is specified at inspection? They do not need to know whether you will be using a power tool
Not directly applicable to a residential construction site though, IMHO.
 
Jraef

Jraef

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Staff member
Location
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GoldDigger said:
By rejecting the receptacle unless the usage is specified at inspection? They do not need to know whether you will be using a power tool
Not directly applicable to a residential construction site though, IMHO.
Click to expand...
Yep.

I have a "storage shed" in my back yard that I used for years as my office in order to get away from the wife and kids during the work day. In order to put it up w/o a permit, I can't have electrical run out to it <wink wink>. So what I did was to put a 30A 230V receptacle in my garage with a permit, but I had to tell the plan inspector, and the AHJ, that is was going to be for a radial arm saw. Then later I ran a portable cord off of a sub panel in my shed and it is plugged into that receptacle.

The point of this was, yes, they insisted on knowing what it was for since I already had a stove and dryer outlet on the plans.
 
T

Tim Keveney

Member
Location
rudyard, mi
peter d said:
Why would you be importing 230 volt tools when all the world's major tool manufacturers make 120 volt versions of their tools? It's not like they aren't aware of the North American market. It sounds like your company needs to go back to the drawing board. Unless these European tools aren't the traditional power tools I'm thinking of (Bosch, Metabo, Festool, etc)
Click to expand...


The main reason I have concern is that this power tool is intended primarily for business use. All of our stationary machines which run on 230V have control circuits. All buttons that operators touch are either 24 volt or 115 volt, as it is not permissible for companies to operate equipment in which the operator can touch a button which is directly connected to 230 Volt. The button is wired to a contacter which engages the 230 volt. This hand tool does not have that secondary safety circuit.

yes you are right - most importers have figured this out - let's just say - "we are special" :roll:
 
mbrooke

mbrooke

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Location
United States
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Technician
Tim Keveney said:
The main reason I have concern is that this power tool is intended primarily for business use. All of our stationary machines which run on 230V have control circuits. All buttons that operators touch are either 24 volt or 115 volt, as it is not permissible for companies to operate equipment in which the operator can touch a button which is directly connected to 230 Volt. The button is wired to a contacter which engages the 230 volt. This hand tool does not have that secondary safety circuit.

yes you are right - most importers have figured this out - let's just say - "we are special" :roll:
Click to expand...

Keep in mind technically the voltage to ground will only be 120 volts. Unlikely a double insulated tool or metal case tool with an EGC will shock let alone getting across the line.

As Iwire said, it is a code violation in dwellings with lighting and loads under 1440va, but from an NEC perspective that does not apply to commercial/industrial.
 
mbrooke

mbrooke

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Location
United States
Occupation
Technician
petersonra said:
I don't believe that to be true.

They might have to install some 230V outlets, but that is not illegal.

What might be a problem is that our 230V is center tap grounded, rather than one of the lines being grounded.
Click to expand...

fmtjfw said:
Typically hand-held, corded tools use ac/dc rated motors because they have good stall characteristics. It is unlikely that the frequency difference would matter, since the current is commutated at a frequency unrelated to line Hz anyway.

If you just intend to sell them to "households" probably anything goes. [Appliances that say "for household use only" are so labelled because they typically do not meet the requirements for use in a place of business.] If you intend to sell them to the construction industry, you may a problem as all temporary circuits must be GFCI-protected and this is usually done with GFCI-receptacles which normally don't come in 240V. Further 240V extension cords are rare. And finally CE listings are not sufficient.

[Doesn't the UK use 120V, center-grounded (like our technical circuits) for construction.]

As to whether or not there is an identified neutral depends on the country and plug -- NO DE; YES UK, FR: others ??

I think most corded hand-held power tools in the US are now double insulated. (2 wire, unpolarized plugs)
Click to expand...


Two things:

120-0-120 vs 0-230 will not make a difference. In cases like this only potential across the line matters. If the machine has a schuko plug it is given polarity will not matter since as all schuko plugs are none polarized.
 
F

fmtjfw

Senior Member
Location
Fairmont, WV, USA
mbrooke said:
Two things:

120-0-120 vs 0-230 will not make a difference. In cases like this only potential across the line matters. If the machine has a schuko plug it is given polarity will not matter since as all schuko plugs are none polarized.
Click to expand...

Except for the French Schukos (grounding pin sticks out of receptacle)
 
kwired

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
petersonra said:
and just how could that possibly be enforced for a portable tool?
Click to expand...
Other then the occasional item like the OP has, there is little demand for anything but 120 volt, as there is seldom a tool less then 1400VA that runs above 240 volts, Electronic items (data processing and accessories in that area) are different, but usually are dual voltage capable.

cowboyjwc said:
I heard about a company that used power tools for assembly, but they kept getting "lost", so they simply switched everything over to 400hz.
Click to expand...
Probably has some wanting 400Hz supply to run them now, they should be lighter weight then their 60 Hz counterparts.
 
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