need some advice

[southernboys]

Hey guys heres my situation I was hired on as a helper by the company that I now work for as a helper about two months ago. The reason I was willing to be hired on as a helper is due to the fact that my conduit skills are not great. I was wiring houses and agreed to take a dollar pay cut to work for these guys. Now two weeks ago I was handed a set of prints and told to run a crew that ranges in size from 3-5 people. this is primarily a mc job with some conduit. now since Im a residential guy this is a simple job for me to run. My question is how much would you guys expect to be paid in my position. I know that this is a national forum but I feel that the diffrent prices throughout this country will help me come to a fair price for both me and the company I work for as always thanks for your input

 

[iwire]

Re: need some advice

I can't see how knowing what people make all over the country is going to help you. Many places will pay substantially more than FL and others may pay less.

You really do not want to know what a NY City IBEW member makes, it will kill all your moral.

I will tell you that as you are unlicensed you are very likely to get taken advantage of by this company.

They are getting licensed guy work at apprentice rates.

Here in MA what they are doing is against the law, we must have a licensed person on the job.

 

[mdshunk]

Re: need some advice

Originally posted by southernboys:
My question is how much would you guys expect to be paid in my position.

I would expect to be paid exactly the amount you negotiated with the owner/manager when you were hired. In time, with quality hard work and added responsibilities, your pay will increase. I get the feeling that you feel you're not paid enough to run a small job. While this may be true at the moment, it's how the game is played. It has nothing to do with electrical contracting. It's just business.

 

[iwire]

Re: need some advice

Originally posted by mdshunk:

Originally posted by southernboys:
My question is how much would you guys expect to be paid in my position.

I would expect to be paid exactly the amount you negotiated with the owner/manager when you were hired.

The heck with that, the job description has changed.

It's time for re-negotiations.

I have never been one to wait for the owner to decide I was worth more, ask for it, get it or move on.

 

[mdshunk]

Re: need some advice

Originally posted by iwire:
I have never been one to wait for the owner to decide I was worth more, ask for it, get it or move on.

I can certianly appreciate that opinoin. I used to feel exactly the same way. After jumping ship many times, my resum? started to fill with "red flags", if you know what I mean. I found it more useful after several years to conduct my job searches with more care. I used the interview process as much to interview the potential employer as they interviewed me. This helped me to remain happy and prosporous in my work. Now that I'm running my own dog and pony show, I notice the guys that have many jobs in a short period of time tend to not work out in the end.

 

[southernboys]

Re: need some advice

j thats kind of my thought line since I live in the work is plentiful state of fl. u know how good it is now just need to get an idea on the pay I can expect so I dont ask for a astronomical price. mdshunk if im hired in as a helper then im a helper not a jobrunner. so how can I wait on the company which we all know will never happen why pay a guy more then what hes ever asked for

 

[iwire]

Re: need some advice

Originally posted by mdshunk:
After jumping ship many times, my resum? started to fill with "red flags", if you know what I mean.

I hear you on that, I am never impressed with coffee time chat from guys that have worked for 100 different contractors.

I have been lucky to get what I want.

 

[tkb]

Re: need some advice

Bob, do you still have the floppy shoes and red nose from the amusement park?

 

[iwire]

Re: need some advice

Originally posted by tkb:
Bob, do you still have the floppy shoes and red nose from the amusement park?

No I never had any of those, but I could not resist trying out the giant "Bevis" costume one time.

[ June 13, 2005, 06:48 PM: Message edited by: iwire ]

 

[growler]

Re: need some advice

Two months is not a long time for the company to see what you can do. But if your going to quit nows the time,you can cover a short break in your work history.
If you really are an electrician, you should never have taken a job as a helper and a pay cut.
Some companies take a year to evaluate a new employee. To be considered a journeyman you normally need 4 to 5 years. You see some companies that say 3, but is hard to cross over with that little. Much of residential is done by rote and electricians feel cocky after a few houses.
If you like the company and want to stay there. Try to get your pay bumped up a little at a time. A dollar or two is easier to get than a large raise based on one job. Make sure you know when you come up for review. See if you have a future with the company. You'll know this by the number of retained workers. See how many people that have been there 10 years. If the oldest employee has been there 2 years. Leave today and don't look back. Good companies keep good people. Others use them and let them go.

 

[hurk27]

Re: need some advice

southernboys

I would Waite until after you have done at least a couple jobs. Most employers don't jump to a rate change before they find out if the person can handle the new position. It's always easier to give a raise then to cut ones pay when you find out they can't cut it in a new position. I'm not saying you can't cut it, but how does you new boss know this. So after having a couple jobs under your belt that turn out good (like no red tag's, or material waste) will give you more of a bargaining chip to work with. When I was working in Fort Myers back in "78" I was put on as lead-man on a high rise condo. After working the first month I was brought up to $9.00 an hour from $6.00 which was good money back then in Florida. I have a few friends that still make that down there but most lead-men should make more, Just don't jump to high. Also having a few other contractor's lined up that would want to hire you also helps in the bargaining, But might hit a sour note if it shows you might not be loyal.

 

[jimwalker]

Re: need some advice

You must have proved something to get that advance in title.Tell them you want paid for the position or shove it.

 

[tkb]

Re: need some advice

Talk to your boss and let him know that you feel this is additional responsibility that was not part of your job description when you took the job.
Then instead of demanding more money before you do this project, let him know that when you prove yourself you will expect more money before the next project he expects you to run.
This way you may get a raise for the additional responsibility and he doesn't have to pay someone more if they cannot handle it.

 

[hardworkingstiff]

Re: need some advice

I think tkb has the right approach. Demanding is not the best 1st choice. I'd try explaining your position, and that you understand his. Maybe you two can come to an agreement that you will work for what you are with a bonus on this job if it goes the way a "proven" job foreman should bring it in, and a raise before starting the next job.

If you decide to go this way, you need to get in writing what the requirements are for "bringing the job in". This needs to be understood and agreed upon by both parties prior to the start of construction.

good luck

 

[bradleyelectric]

Re: need some advice

A company that I worked for, but didn't care much for fired the person running the job that I was on. I'd have to admit it was not a bad move on the companies part. It was just me and the guy on the job. The superintendant for my company came around the corner and started to say to me that "Fred" was no longer with the company. I knew damn well his next line was going to be that it was my show. I had heard that the company had let everyone go that had more than 2 years with them and I knew that I was not going to get more money, so I cut him off and asked him if he was going to have someone on the job tommorrow to run it. He did. All us guys that started the same time as me got laid off right before our year us up.
I really think it is something when a guy asks for a certain pay when he is hired, and immediately starts telling the other guys that I am taking advantage of him because of what I am paying him. All I gave him was what he asked for. If he wouldn't be happy with it, why did he ask for it in the first place?

 

[southernboys]

Re: need some advice

bradly I hope you dont mean me because none of the guys on my crew know that I feel that im underpaid. When I was hired I was hired as a helper ie no stress now I have to worry about these guys staying busy if someone from the office shows up on the job and making sure these guys do there job correctly. the crew I have is nothing but green and it feels like I have to constantly stand over there shoulder to make sure they do there job correctly. plus I have a time period to bring this job in on. ive already got the walls roughed in and majority of the homeruns pulled so ill be getting my inspection as soon as theres an available inspector. thus my question as how to aproach my boss over me for a raise

 

[william runkle]

Re: need some advice

Is this the same company you posted about that miss wired in an attic and the job runner told you to do it that way? If it is the same company it sounds like your moving in the right direction just take your time and learn and be willing to tackle the bigger projects down the road. This is the advice I received starting my apprenticeship You can become a Master Electrician in six years but you will not master at electricity until you have been in the trade 30 years. I am just getting my thirty years now and I still haven't mastered it yet but I will not stop trying to tackle new and bigger projects.

 

[stud696981]

Re: need some advice

Sounds like you need a raise. Here in Michigan you must have a licensed Journyman or Master electrician on the job ANY time electrical work is being done.

 

[highkvoltage]

Re: need some advice

I agree with most of the viewpoints,you should get paid for the job you are pre forming. On the other hand they may be testing you to see what you know. Why not run the first job show them you can do the job then go for the raise. There are people who can run work and people who can't. Then if things don't work out you now have a little more experience in the commercial trade to market yourself with. Remember experience will give you knowledge, but knowledge doesn't give you experience. Who would you hire? If you are successful in running this job and they don't cough up the dough I would walk. PS: I have left contractors for this very reason.

 

[southernboys]

Re: need some advice

hey guys I apreciate all of you alls input. right as I was getting ready to go into the office the guy I was working with prior to this opportunity called the office and asked for me to come back to his crew. so that kind of shot me down for the time but also strengthened my case for that raise since this guy personally asked for me. Im going to work with him for another month or two strengthen my resume and then hit the company up for my overdue raise thanks once again