Is this legal?

[ramsy]

See existing #8 service drop on panel flipper's outdoor 100A breaker HOM20M100RB

This #8 wire is type TW, 40A max, since not listed beyond 60° C.



NEC 230.79(C) says 100A disconnect is OK

2pole 40A breaker in building #1 protects customer-side drop for this panel at building #2.

Is existing 40A Service drop allowed here?

 

[augie47]

Don't know when it was installed but I don't think a #8 was ever allowed for a 100 amp service.
My bet would be an original smaller service was not changed out when the 100 amp panel was installed.

 

[texie]

If I read the OP correctly, this is just a panel fed by a feeder that is protected at 40 amps. In that case the breaker at he remote panel is just acting as a switch and could by any value 40 amps or more.

 

[hbiss]

2pole 40A breaker in building #1 protects customer-side drop for this panel at building #2.

Are you saying that there is a 40A breaker supplying this panel? If so all is good. the 100A main is allowed.

-Hal

 

[ramsy]

Are you saying that there is a 40A breaker supplying this panel? If so all is good. the 100A main is allowed.

-Hal

Yes, 40A breaker supplies this panel.

Thank you. Never seen this before.

 

[augie47]

If I read the OP correctly, this is just a panel fed by a feeder that is protected at 40 amps. In that case the breaker at he remote panel is just acting as a switch and could by any value 40 amps or more.

Thank you.
I msiread.
The term "service" in this case I believe would actually be "feeder"

 

[ramsy]

Don't know when it was installed but I don't think a #8 was ever allowed for a 100 amp service.

Is it possible that #8 TW pre-dates 100A requirement in 230.79(C), along with single conductor airials missing messenger support, tied to porcelain insulators on roof?

Or 230 is wrong section for this feeder?

 

[jap]

It looks to my like the Neutral may be a #8 but the red looks like it's a solid conductor, so, more than likely it's a #10.

Not sure what size the black conductor is.

Jap>

 

[jap]

If I read the OP correctly, this is just a panel fed by a feeder that is protected at 40 amps. In that case the breaker at he remote panel is just acting as a switch and could by any value 40 amps or more.

If the feeder to the subpanel is properly protected at 40 amps, I don't see why the the breaker at the remote panel couldn't also be any value 40 amps or "Less".

Jap>

 

[ramsy]

It looks to my like the Neutral may be a #8 but the red looks like it's a solid conductor, so, more than likely it's a #10.

Not sure what size the black conductor is.

Jap>

Yes, it appears solid #10 on both red & black. Excellent eye sir.

 

[texie]

If the feeder to the subpanel is properly protected at 40 amps, I don't see why the the breaker at the remote panel couldn't also be any value 40 amps or "Less".

Jap>

Well, it could but then why have a 40 amp feeder. But yes, it could be any size.

 

[ramsy]

Well, it could but then why have a 40 amp feeder. But yes, it could be any size.

1) Supplier says Homeline doesn't make smaller MB's that fit that panel HOM20M100RB.

2) NEC 230.79 applies to this article 220 dwelling, supplied by this junk.

 

[kwired]

1) Supplier says Homeline doesn't make smaller MB's that fit that panel HOM20M100RB.

2) NEC 230.79 applies to this article 220 dwelling, supplied by this junk.

They do make QOM breakers in all standard sizes 50 - 125 amps except for 110 amp.

Not saying you will find all them in stock very easily. I think 60 amp is somewhat common though, as well as 100 and 125.

8 AWG solid used to be more common years ago and not just bare conductor either.

 

[ramsy]

Fire-Hazard violation of NEC 220.83 may exist for any 30A feeder, serving an existing 1-family dweling.

A 30 Amp feeder is not adequate for any occupancy that runs appliances together; such as Microwave & toaster, or Coffee pot & laundry, space heaters, Air Conditioners, hair dryers & vacuum, much less a single 30A HVAC or electric clothes dryer apliance.

 

[ramsy]

They do make QOM breakers in all standard sizes

Are those Main breakers? This is a MB panel.

Or, are you proposing to Backfeed a plug-in breaker with a hold down kit?

 

[kwired]

Are those Main breakers? This is a MB panel.

Or, are you proposing to Backfeed a plug-in breaker with a hold down kit?

QOM series is what you had a picture of in OP. It is what Square D uses as main in both QO and Homeline loadcenters.

 

[ramsy]

QOM series is what you had a picture of in OP. It is what Square D uses as main in both QO and Homeline loadcenters.

You would make a better supplier than mine

 

[kwired]

You would make a better supplier than mine

They don't have any catalog numbers for panels with factory installed mains other than 100 and 125 amp (in this QOM series mains, the 150-225 are QOM2, but also are available in sizes other than what you may find factory installed.

So if you wanted a 60 amp main you either need to swap the 100 or 125 factory installed main, or buy a main lug panel and install the 60 amp main, in place of the main lugs. They don't have a hold down for backfed breakers in this line of loadcenters, so you can't just plug in a 60 amp and backfeed it for a main.

 

[electrofelon]

They do make QOM breakers in all standard sizes 50 - 125 amps except for 110 amp.

Interesting, never new that

 

[jap]

1) Supplier says Homeline doesn't make smaller MB's that fit that panel HOM20M100RB.

2) NEC 230.79 applies to this article 220 dwelling, supplied by this junk.

There's no need to change the main out in the subpanel.
The main in this subpanel is serving as nothing more than a disconnect.
It is not serving as the means of overcurrent protection.
The 40a breaker feeding it is the overcurrent protection for the panel although oversized seeing as how the black and red phase conductors are actually #10 not # 8.

Jap>