are we "electrocuting" marine life

iwire · Aug 29, 2005

Re: are we "electrocuting" marine life

Sam now you have changed the subject matter entirely.

You had been talking about electron flow through the oceans.

Now you have moved to EMF which is not at all the same subject.

The EMF radiating from undersea cables should drop off rapidly as the distance increases.

sam ford · Aug 30, 2005

Re: are we "electrocuting" marine life

maybe i should rephrase my question to "are we electromagnetically executing marine life"
alternating (accelerating)current flow(electrons)create an outwardly expanding electromagnetic radiation.
the higher the frequency the more power.salt water is a greater conductor than air.the concept my question is directed towards is that of current flowing between the various land based generating systems thru the oceans creating electromagnetic radiation to the detriment of the marine life in addition to that being sprayed from above and thru by satellites/communications/military etc.
some of the replys have been more towards undersea cabling.in my original post i referred to work by reba and her notes about a proposed undersea cable.
in reading thru the site above on a north sea cable some points came out.it was a high voltage dc system with a wire cable return.the world would be better off if this was the way we deliver power above ground??as a constant dc system doesn't radiate energy.they measured a constant magnetic field comparible to that of the natural earth's which itself fluctuates but depending on the orientation of the wire could be at right angles to it??however the environmental tests done in '59 were in an era when there wasn't as loud an electromagnetic buzz as we now all have in us.there is evidence that suggests a possible modulation effect by power line frequencies to high frequencies??have they followed up to see how those fish who swam or lived thru this are doing today?has the eco system around the cables changed in the years since this was installed?
they also make reference to the return currents of single cable systems as going deep down into the earth rather than thru salt water .can any one explain how that could be measured?is the deep earth a lower resistance path?
as reba points out artificial induced radiation has the capability to do damage to cells (and problems which mysteriously don't show up till years after)-which are by human scale incredibly small with their components again many orders of magnitude "smaller".i have seen references to nano amp currents as causing problems.it is such a complex situation that much like particle physics it is very "strange" to our knowledge.

sam ford · Aug 30, 2005

Re: are we "electrocuting" marine life

....and as a followup to an above post stating that the electrons would return to their source in a generator....in a gas genertaor with a send/return closed loop circuit this would apply.however in the case of a land based/grounded system those in the return wires would but those leaking into the ground return could find themselves in a situation of capacitance or inductance depending on where and what the ground was like where they were dropped and would be out of sync or delayed in time with respect to the instantaneous pull create by the magnetic force that sent them there some hundreds of miles thru low resistance wiring.at 186,000 miles/second a couple of hundred miles is not a big deal but it is finite and if there was resistance in the form of collisions with atoms or attraction to chemical rections/bonds in the soil/vegetation/rock/etc. would it not be that the suction/void left at the generator could be filled by whatever was closer in time or easier to find/attract which might be far underground/from aquifers/oceans/etc.electrons whatever they are aren't bonded for life to any particular atom!and if those electrons had a push because they were at a different potential from a generating system elsewhere could they not stand a chance of being firest online??

charlie b · Aug 30, 2005

Re: are we "electrocuting" marine life

First, I'll offer a few facts, or reiterate a few facts that others have offered:

Planet earth (i.e., dirt) is a better conductor than salt water.

Current does not flow through an ocean by virtue of the physical motion of electrons, but rather by virtue of the physical motion of charged atoms and molecules (i.e., "ions").

Current does not take the path of least resistance, but rather takes all available paths.

Current is not seeking a path to planet Earth. It is seeking a path to its source.

Secondly, your use of the following phrases has led me to conclude that you have far, far less knowledge and understanding of electricity than you think you have.

"magnetic electron pumps"

"macro instant"

"electrons . . . are being 'pushed' to ground"

"(electrons) . . . are being 'pulled' from ground"

"neutral with the overall polarity of the earth's surface"

"path of least resistance"

"the higher the frequency the more power"

"a situation of capacitance or inductance"

Next, your use of the following phrases has led me to believe that you are using creative writing in an effort to spark an emotional response, as opposed to technical writing, the purpose of which is to convey information.

"altering the natural magnetic heartbeat"

"outwardly expanding electromagnetic radiation"

"as loud an electromagnetic buzz"

"possible modulation effect by power line frequencies to high frequencies"

Finally, it seems clear to me that you are not here to seek information. Rather, you are attempting to use this Forum as a podium for advancing your political or sociological agenda. That is not within our rules. Our purpose is to help each other learn and understand more about the electrical professions. We achieve this purpose by posting and addressing specific questions related to the code, to installation means and methods, and to a host of other topics.

We are not here as a captive audience, to be preached to by a person who does not understand the topic on which he is preaching.

Take your business elsewhere. This thread is closed.

are we "electrocuting" marine life

iwire

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sam ford

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sam ford

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charlie b

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