RSID on facade or in garage?

[Zee]

Planning resid. Enphase system. (No batteries)
City hinting that we need an ACD or Rapid Shutdown Initiation Device (RSID) on front of house.
They wrote:
"There is also a rapid shutdown initiation device to consider according to 690.12(C).
This device is defined as being located at a readily accessible location."

However, all (E) Meter, main panels and service discos are in garage.
Can the RSID just be the (E) service disco as per usual?

PS I am tieing PV into 3rd floor sub panel, just under roof...............and have no intention of running all teh circuits down to ground on front (ugly too) .

 

[jaggedben]

They are right and it sounds like you're going to have to rethink your intentions.

Perhaps you can divert the feeder for the subpanel to an outside disconnect or subpanel if you don't want to run the solar down the wall. Or replace the breaker to it with a shut trip.

If the service disconnect were outside it wouldn't be an issue, that could be your RSID.

 

[jaggedben]

One thing to add: the RSID only needs to be outside for one and two family dwellings. For a larger apartment or commercial building you're okay. Just tell them it's in the garage.

 

[solarken]

Does your enphase system include a combiner that supports an external RSI switch? If so it is only control wiring down to the groundfloor and may be easier to keep aesthetics.

 

[jaggedben]

The Enphase combiner doesn't support a remote switch. That's something he'd have to rig up himself with a shunt trip or contactor or something.

 

[ggunn]

Most AHJs we deal with require an external disconnect for the PV system; for a PV system with microinverters, that is the RSID. If the building only has an external main service disconnect, that is the RSID.

 

[pv_n00b]

With the 2017 NEC we have the requirement to have the ID outside the building. Since almost all the houses in CA have outside service disconnects this is not a problem. But any home with an inside service disconnect is going to be a problem. If you can get the AHJ to accept the inside service disconnect under 90.4 you are good to go, otherwise, you are going to be running some more circuits.

 

[Zee]

Good answers. Thank you.
I'll rethink my intentions. (Don't get me misunderstood, my intentions were good.........)
I guess i don't understand the LOGIC. If the service discos and services are all inside garage......and allowable there........wouldn't that be considered readily accessible or "good enough" for shut down of the whole house?
I wonder why shutdown of solar is critical but not the house?

I see i may lose the Code argument tho.
Funny, I just passed inspection, in same AHJ, with exact same situation (all service and meter equipment inside garage) and installed nothing on front. I guess I should count myslef lucky on that one!

 

[Zee]

BTW - in these very urban, row house situations, where homes are packed side by side ( no side yards.) and all service discos are inside............how does Fire Dept, etc gain access? Do they have a lock/code to garages?

 

[jaggedben]

Good answers. Thank you.
I'll rethink my intentions. (Don't get me misunderstood, my intentions were good.........)
I guess i don't understand the LOGIC. If the service discos and services are all inside garage......and allowable there........wouldn't that be considered readily accessible or "good enough" for shut down of the whole house?
I wonder why shutdown of solar is critical but not the house?

It's not 'good enough' anymore. 230.85 is now in effect in California. Search the forum for that code section.

Mind you, this all still only applies to one and two family dwellings.

 

[pv_n00b]

I guess i don't understand the LOGIC. If the service discos and services are all inside garage......and allowable there........wouldn't that be considered readily accessible or "good enough" for shut down of the whole house?
I wonder why shutdown of solar is critical but not the house?

You are looking for logic in all the wrong places. Codes change and under the 2020 NEC inside service disconnects for one and two-family dwellings are no longer allowed. The AHJ won't make you move the service disconnect, but they can make you put the RSID outside. The RSID just needs to be a contact, the big red button, that controls the RSD system. You don't have to run the power conductors to an outside disconnect to have an RSID.