mbrooke
Batteries Included
- Location
- United States
- Occupation
- Technician
Anyone willing to make a proposal for a table like this? Similar yet separate table for motors, tap rules and welder circuits. I think it would clear up a lot of confusion.
New EGC selection table
- Thread starter mbrooke
- Start date
- Status
- Location
- Illinois
- Occupation
- retired electrician
You would need a lot of technical substantiation to get any change in the EGC sizing table. It is very difficult to accomplish.
petersonra
Senior Member
- Location
- Northern illinois
- Occupation
- engineer
the current code for sizing EGCs does not go by wire size but by rating of the OCPD.
where are these rule numbers from anyway?
where are these rule numbers from anyway?
- Location
- New Jersey
- Occupation
- Journeyman Electrician
Looks like the CEC-Canadian Electrical Code.
- Location
- Chapel Hill, NC
- Occupation
- Retired Electrical Contractor
That table is for bonding conductor while you mentioned equipment grounding conductor. Maybe Canada calls the equipment grounding conductor a bond.
mbrooke
Batteries Included
- Location
- United States
- Occupation
- Technician
Technical substantiation just to get the code better organized?
mbrooke
Batteries Included
- Location
- United States
- Occupation
- Technician
Canadian Electrical Code
Yup, they EGCs bonding conductor. Makes much more sense.
- Location
- Illinois
- Occupation
- retired electrician
Yes, they did what the NEC should have done...changed equipment grounding conductor to equipment bonding conductor. The function of that conductor has nothing to do with a connection to earth.
- Location
- Illinois
- Occupation
- retired electrician
That is a technical change as you are basing the EGC size on the size of the ungrounded circuit conductor, but the current code is based on the size of the upstream OCPD.
For the record a table like that was approved in the first revision of the 2020, but deleted in the second revision as there are too many other changes in other parts of the code that have to be made for a table based on the size of the ungrounded conductor to work.
mbrooke
Batteries Included
- Location
- United States
- Occupation
- Technician
Then have multiple tables for each condition. Motors, tap rules, welders, ect.
kwired
Electron manager
- Location
- NE Nebraska
Point kind of is you really need to impress them to change something that has been the way it is practically forever. Only changes that have happened here were pretty minor changes here and there, you want to dump the thing out and put it back in a different manner.
- Location
- Illinois
- Occupation
- retired electrician
Then you have plenty of time to work out all of those details...the PIs for the 2026 code will be due in September of 2026. Iti is highly unlikely that CMP 5 would accept a solution that requires multiple additional tables, and if they did, I would submit Public Comments in opposition. Additional tables would make the code more difficult to use and understand.
Given the issues when a table like this was tried for the 2020 code, I would be very surprised if CMP 5 would ever accept a PI to use an EGC sizing table based on the size of the ungrounded conductors.
NOTE: the due date for 2026 proposals is September of 2023, not 2026 as I said.
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mbrooke
Batteries Included
- Location
- United States
- Occupation
- Technician
Man..
You really got to get out and get a job..
This stuff is making you crazy..
You're the reason the code is what it is today. Keep detracting
mbrooke
Batteries Included
- Location
- United States
- Occupation
- Technician
Nope, that would be your pessimism talking.
The tables would be self explanatory as they would be labelled for the condition of use. It worked in Canada, its working in most other countries.
And your the reason I'm going to click “ignore”...You're the reason the code is what it is today. Keep detracting
mbrooke
Batteries Included
- Location
- United States
- Occupation
- Technician
kwired
Electron manager
- Location
- NE Nebraska
Sure you have the right date there? Likely will be able to purchase a copy in September or October of 2025
kwired
Electron manager
- Location
- NE Nebraska
What is the confusion now? The rule is basically size with one table and per overcurrent device. EGC never needs to be larger than the largest ungrounded conductor for motors, taps, etc.
Only other issue is when you need to upsize EGC proportionally to an upsized ungrounded conductor. If that is too hard to do maybe one needs to re-evaluate whether they are cut out for their job. I find many other somewhat routine calculations for this kind of job to be more confusing, start with art 220.
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