Everyone seems to dance around the issue of what to do with pool bonding when you have equipment at a remote location. Pool bonding according to my understanding and the actual code requirement is to "eliminate voltage gradients in the pool area" and is not intended to apply to a remote area as indicated in the fine print note. This is why in the 2005 the wording was changed to "Equipotential Bonding" to try to clarify the confusion that exists. The pool bonding is for the immediate pool area only and doesn't extend to the equipment if at a remote location.
Inground Pool Bonding
- Thread starter Kenosha
- Start date
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jwelectric
Senior Member
- Location
- North Carolina
Re: Inground Pool Bonding
680.26 Equipotential Bonding.
(A) Performance.
(B) Bonded Parts.
(1) Metallic Structural Components.
(2) Underwater Lighting.
(3) Metal Fittings.
(4) Electrical Equipment.
(5) Metal Wiring Methods and Equipment
(C) Equipotential Bonding Grid. The parts specified in 680.26(B) shall be connected to an equipotential bonding grid
680.26 Equipotential Bonding.
(A) Performance.
(B) Bonded Parts.
(1) Metallic Structural Components.
(2) Underwater Lighting.
(3) Metal Fittings.
(4) Electrical Equipment.
(5) Metal Wiring Methods and Equipment
(C) Equipotential Bonding Grid. The parts specified in 680.26(B) shall be connected to an equipotential bonding grid
pierre
Senior Member
- Location
- Westchester County, New York
Re: Inground Pool Bonding
Actually if the equipment is remotely located, it will be required to be bonded if it is on the list in 680.26.
I just took some pictures the other day of a heater and pool pump that are about 30 feet from the pool and are bonded to the grid.
Actually if the equipment is remotely located, it will be required to be bonded if it is on the list in 680.26.
I just took some pictures the other day of a heater and pool pump that are about 30 feet from the pool and are bonded to the grid.
dana1028
Senior Member
- Location
- San Francisco Bay area
Re: Inground Pool Bonding
1. FPN are not part of the code, just 'for-your-information' types of comments.
2. The language of this FPN is to let installers/inspector know that the bonding conductor is not required to terminate in a panelboard...the purpose of this bonding is to eliminate voltage gradients; thus terminating in a panelboard is not necessary.
3. 'in the pool area' - I certainly consider a circulating pool pump motor 30 ft. away as being 'in the area'.
4. The language in 680.26(B) spells out specifically those components mandated to be bonded together. You could argue that 'in the pool area' is open to interpretation; you cannot argue about which components must be bonded together because the code spells them out for you.
1. FPN are not part of the code, just 'for-your-information' types of comments.
2. The language of this FPN is to let installers/inspector know that the bonding conductor is not required to terminate in a panelboard...the purpose of this bonding is to eliminate voltage gradients; thus terminating in a panelboard is not necessary.
3. 'in the pool area' - I certainly consider a circulating pool pump motor 30 ft. away as being 'in the area'.
4. The language in 680.26(B) spells out specifically those components mandated to be bonded together. You could argue that 'in the pool area' is open to interpretation; you cannot argue about which components must be bonded together because the code spells them out for you.
Re: Inground Pool Bonding
Now I can see where all the misunderstanding is and why the code change for 2005. We are NOT bonding we are creating an equipotential grid. I think it would be impossible to touch the remote pool equipment unless it is in the pool area. The whole idea is to reduce touch potential to a metal part when exiting the pool area. Why would you want to take any possible stray voltage out to the pool area when you have a grounding electrode system at the remote pool equipment location by connection to the electrical service equipment.
Now I can see where all the misunderstanding is and why the code change for 2005. We are NOT bonding we are creating an equipotential grid. I think it would be impossible to touch the remote pool equipment unless it is in the pool area. The whole idea is to reduce touch potential to a metal part when exiting the pool area. Why would you want to take any possible stray voltage out to the pool area when you have a grounding electrode system at the remote pool equipment location by connection to the electrical service equipment.
Re: Inground Pool Bonding
i dont know what you are talking about,dont know what type of inspector you are but i hope it is not a electrical inspector.because the code is pretty clear ,its not to be use as a learning tool. if it was it would have a explantion of why it is wrote like that.
i dont know what you are talking about,dont know what type of inspector you are but i hope it is not a electrical inspector.because the code is pretty clear ,its not to be use as a learning tool. if it was it would have a explantion of why it is wrote like that.
Re: Inground Pool Bonding
If it was clear they wouldn't have to make changes to the article we are talking about. My point is the language should not say pool AREA if they intend it to extend beyond that. The pump motor is actually bonded to the pool area through the equipment ground which is run with the pool lighting and pool cover motor which in turn go to the control panel. I think the last paragraph in 680.26(B)(4) talks about this type of connection. If the stray voltage they are worried about comes from the motor the equipment ground should take care of that same way as with gas piping being bonded through the equipment ground for furnaces.
If it was clear they wouldn't have to make changes to the article we are talking about. My point is the language should not say pool AREA if they intend it to extend beyond that. The pump motor is actually bonded to the pool area through the equipment ground which is run with the pool lighting and pool cover motor which in turn go to the control panel. I think the last paragraph in 680.26(B)(4) talks about this type of connection. If the stray voltage they are worried about comes from the motor the equipment ground should take care of that same way as with gas piping being bonded through the equipment ground for furnaces.
pierre
Senior Member
- Location
- Westchester County, New York
Re: Inground Pool Bonding
(A) is the performance portion, with the other subsections being the perscriptive portion.
So the bonding is for the pool area and the designated pool equipment.
(A) is the performance portion, with the other subsections being the perscriptive portion.
So the bonding is for the pool area and the designated pool equipment.
Re: Inground Pool Bonding
1st of all a FPN print not is not enforceable, its just a reference.
if you read 680.24 you will see that if you have any egc connected to the pool bonding grid. you must bond the circulating pumps or electric heaters or other electrical devices that are associated to the pool circulating system, back to the pool bonding grid even if they are remote to the pool.
now if egc does not connected to the pool bonding grid, then you would not extent the pool bonding grid to other electrical equipment if they are located remote from the pool.
now when i am talking about egc connected to the pool bonding grid, that would be through the pool light or an electric pool cover or ect..
1st of all a FPN print not is not enforceable, its just a reference.
if you read 680.24 you will see that if you have any egc connected to the pool bonding grid. you must bond the circulating pumps or electric heaters or other electrical devices that are associated to the pool circulating system, back to the pool bonding grid even if they are remote to the pool.
now if egc does not connected to the pool bonding grid, then you would not extent the pool bonding grid to other electrical equipment if they are located remote from the pool.
now when i am talking about egc connected to the pool bonding grid, that would be through the pool light or an electric pool cover or ect..
hey_poolboy
Senior Member
- Location
- Illinois
Re: Inground Pool Bonding
I know this doesn't help now, but I have the opportunity to attend the IAEI meeting in our area in May. I plan to attend a seminar that they are having in regard to pool bonding. If I find anything useful I will be sure to post it.
I know this doesn't help now, but I have the opportunity to attend the IAEI meeting in our area in May. I plan to attend a seminar that they are having in regard to pool bonding. If I find anything useful I will be sure to post it.
Re: Inground Pool Bonding
We all agree that an equipotential grid needs to be installed at the pool. The only thing we dont agree on is where it has to be taken to from there. My thought is that the connection to equipment ground at the pool light and pool cover motor should be sufficient to establish the equipotential plane to the pool.
We all agree that an equipotential grid needs to be installed at the pool. The only thing we dont agree on is where it has to be taken to from there. My thought is that the connection to equipment ground at the pool light and pool cover motor should be sufficient to establish the equipotential plane to the pool.
jwelectric
Senior Member
- Location
- North Carolina
Re: Inground Pool Bonding
Most above ground pools are less than 42 inches and fall under the requirements of part III of 680. Should the pool have more than 42 inches of water at the maximum fill then it would fall under part II.
Most above ground pools are less than 42 inches and fall under the requirements of part III of 680. Should the pool have more than 42 inches of water at the maximum fill then it would fall under part II.
bill addiss
Senior Member
Re: Inground Pool Bonding
For what it's worth, that's not the case in my area.
Bill
jwelectric,
For what it's worth, that's not the case in my area.
Bill
jwelectric
Senior Member
- Location
- North Carolina
Re: Inground Pool Bonding
Permanently Installed Swimming, Wading, and Therapeutic Pools. Those that are constructed in the ground or partially in the ground, and all others capable of holding water in a depth greater than 1.0 m (42 in.), and all pools installed inside of a building, regardless of water depth, whether or not served by electrical circuits of any nature.
I was in a discussion with a couple of inspectors a couple of weeks ago when we hit on 680.26 and the above ground pool with a wooden deck. After a couple of hours listening to them attaching ground rods to the 4x4 post and bonding a #8 to the decking screws I couldn?t take any more. There was one suggestion of maybe trying to fill the pool with dry water but a way to dry the water couldn?t be reached.
Permanently Installed Swimming, Wading, and Therapeutic Pools. Those that are constructed in the ground or partially in the ground, and all others capable of holding water in a depth greater than 1.0 m (42 in.), and all pools installed inside of a building, regardless of water depth, whether or not served by electrical circuits of any nature.
I was in a discussion with a couple of inspectors a couple of weeks ago when we hit on 680.26 and the above ground pool with a wooden deck. After a couple of hours listening to them attaching ground rods to the 4x4 post and bonding a #8 to the decking screws I couldn?t take any more. There was one suggestion of maybe trying to fill the pool with dry water but a way to dry the water couldn?t be reached.
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