Helpers

[MiamiValleyelec]

I know everyone is different but how long do you think it takes for a new guy to become a “good helper”? Know what material and tools will be needed for a task without needing to be told, when helping not needing to be told every step… I’m talking about commercial work but for conversation let’s include residential and industrial work.

 

[LarryFine]

There is no answer because it depends on the individual's interest and aptitude.

Some want to learn and pay attention, others just can't wait for the day to end.

Added: A motivated helper should become competent within a month or two.

 

[letgomywago]

It also depends on what they're helping with. Doing service work and handing tools to you they should catch on quick for how to help. With new stuff and new experiences it might take them longer. I believe the best education that is thrown away is the time in the van. If they ride with you keep the questions going explain stuff and the history it'll keep their mind active and knowledge progressing.

 

[TwoBlocked]

I know everyone is different but how long do you think it takes for a new guy to become a “good helper”? Know what material and tools will be needed for a task without needing to be told, when helping not needing to be told every step… I’m talking about commercial work but for conversation let’s include residential and industrial work.

With a "Good Journeyman" I'd say a ballpark figure is 2 months to turn a kid off the street into a "Good Helper." To me, that's someone that is earning their entry-level wages. But if the Journeyman isn't "good" (knowledge, experience, organization, and humanity) maybe never.

 

[MiamiValleyelec]

Man, I was thinking in terms of years not months. What if I changed helper to apprentice? Does that change anyone’s answer? To be able to apply what you have learned in one situation and apply it to another. Im wondering how patient to be with guys?

I know there is a big learning curve. For a couple months they’re pulling mc, then they’re helping run conduit, then it’s setting gear, lights, laying out…

If someone is helping and you ask if it’s level and they say “it looks level”. That’s not what I’m asking, put a level on it. How long do you have to keep thinking for guys? Or spelling out every step.

 

[ptonsparky]

How long? It depends on your patience. The more one on one time you have, truck time is an excellent adder, the better. You can't do this with helpers or apprentices you hired last week for an eight month project.

 

[infinity]

Man, I was thinking in terms of years not months. What if I changed helper to apprentice? Does that change anyone’s answer? To be able to apply what you have learned in one situation and apply it to another. Im wondering how patient to be with guys?

Our apprenticeship is 5 1/2 years. Even after they've made it journeyman status many lack the skills of a seasoned journeyman. I've worked with many apprentices in my nearly 40 year career and you can tell rather quickly which ones will excel and which ones should look for another line of work.

 

[ggunn]

IMO there are many variables. Is the guy someone who is actively and aggressively (for lack of a better term) seeking to become good or great at what he is doing, or does he just want to get by day to day? How much education in basic physics has he had? How much basic intelligence does he bring to the table? How well does he respond to criticism? Can he follow directions? Etc.

 

[ptonsparky]

My help of 25 years +-, started because his Sister in law asked me if I had a spot for a kid who needed something to do. Early on we had a discussion about keeping busy on jobsites, even if it meant picking up a broom and sweeping the floor behind the carpenters when I wasn't there.

 

[letgomywago]

IMO there are many variables. Is the guy someone who is actively and aggressively (for lack of a better term) seeking to become good or great at what he is doing, or does he just want to get by day to day? How much education in basic physics has he had? How much basic intelligence does he bring to the table? How well does he respond to criticism? Can he follow directions? Etc.

the criticism and how they respond is really important. some guys cant handle constructive discussions and flip out when something non constructive is said. those kind of induviduals may even become electricians but they'll never be great ones and are terrible helpers.

 

[LarryFine]

A good helper watches what the electrician is doing and always shines the flashlight in the right direction.

 

[ptonsparky]

A good helper watches what the electrician is doing and always shines the flashlight in the right direction.

That flashlight bit, don't expect that overnight.

 

[MiamiValleyelec]

We get guys that 5 years in can’t make a decision or apply their knowledge, then there are guys that are running work after 3 years. I sometimes think something’s are common sense when I guess they’re not. I do my best to keep my composure, it is frustrating when a second or third year watch you work and stand there waiting for you to tell them what todo

 

[MiamiValleyelec]

I’m trying to figure out ways to make apprentices more productive and well rounded

 

[LarryFine]

I’m trying to figure out ways to make apprentices more productive and well rounded

Let them see you always accepting new employee applications.



You really can't. I got into the field because I love wiring, not just to have a job.

 

[MiamiValleyelec]

Unfortunately it’s not my company, I still work for someone else, I just have my contractors license for side work. I do want the company I work for to be successful though. I enjoy teaching the younger guys, it gets frustrating sometimes. I wonder how much energy I should put into guys.

 

[ptonsparky]

The ones that ask questions, other than if it's break time yet.

 

[TwoBlocked]

Unfortunately it’s not my company, I still work for someone else, I just have my contractors license for side work. I do want the company I work for to be successful though. I enjoy teaching the younger guys, it gets frustrating sometimes. I wonder how much energy I should put into guys.

Yeah, I feel your pain. Got a good kid working with me right now that has a natural aptitude and interest in electrical work, especially indication and control. But... (of course there are buts) he's not mechanically inclined and knows he works awkwardly. Still, that can be worked on. What can't be fixed so easily is management. He is slated to do transmitter calibrations starting next month. In this case it is a mentally high pressure job he has muffed before. The manager's solution is to put more pressure on the kid by emphasizing how he CANNOT MESS THIS UP!!! The kid is looking for another job, and I've made some suggestions. He's a good kid.

So how much energy should we put into guys? As much as THEY are worth, not what WE may or may not get out of it.

 

[cadpoint]

The average length of employment with one company is 4.3 years for men and 3.8 for women. Google

Most American's are now spoiled brat's of any age, IMO . . . I self spoil thank you

You've got to face it, a lot of us are now a generation removed, and I don't care what anyone says it's just
different now. I also believe that you know yourself where this person is at career wise!
Some people are approachable some are not, and I'm sure you know that, I like to call it a person's
personal idiocies (traits) which goes way beyond the Big 5 basic personality traits.

Have you had any career discussions with them?

My best approach for me is to be upfront, honest, consistent and explain the cause and effect of the work. Teach them
to apply it correctly. I've used a few phrase's over the years: "Were here to protect the wire.", "Were here to touch it once",
"No one should need to come back to this work, except to service-repair, or demo", "Everything about this install work should
at 100% in respects to what your doing-thus inspect-able".

What I've surmised as in the many years one has to be hungry for this trade, Or any trade for that matter.
It's either their in or not. All while being be politically correct.
The tell, doesn't take long.(as said)

Self starters is a good sign and from your lessons some aspect should start showing to you, or that you've even reached them.
That is if they even want to be with you. They should remember the previous lessons - when doing a repetitive job... Where going to do this, we'll need this and this and their grabbing the right stuff.

Most of the time for me now it's just a fall-in situation and get it... but new people don't even understand this aspect.

 

[petersonra]

I think people expect way too much out of entry level employees. Employees need ongoing feedback, especially entry level employees. They are lost if they do not know if what they are doing is acceptable or not.

It is time consuming but worth it to make sure you let them know the good and bad of what they are doing. Focus on the good. You did not respond well to negative feedback even though you don't remember it that way.

They also need to know their efforts are appreciated. This is something most bosses are awful at. They want to buy pizza instead of giving out an off the cuff kind word. Trust me on this, the pizza is nice but a kind word from the boss every few days is worth a lot more