I have been an Electrician for 23 years and have held a Ca Lic for 15 years and have been building a buisness for the last 16 months. I have 4 guy's 3 Journeymen one Apprentice plus myself when I have time to get my bags on, I just want to get everyone's input in simular situations of what not to do? Thanx for any input you can add.
Avoiding Mistakes
- Thread starter sparkster
- Start date
- Status
luke warmwater
Senior Member
Re: Avoiding Mistakes
Don't lose your cool in front of your employees.
You're the boss and they need to follow your example.
Don't lose your cool in front of your employees.
You're the boss and they need to follow your example.
Re: Avoiding Mistakes
I've been in the electrical industry for over 20 years and in the estimating/project mgt. field of it for the past 7 years. I've had numerous encounters with irate customers in the past wanting to know things such as "When will you be done", "Why does this cost so much", and so on and on and on.
There's no quick fix answer. The best advice I can offer is to be upfront and honest before they even ask. Keeping customers informed upfront with good and bad news or delays will help them work their schedules better and they'll appreciate your efforts alot more.
Take your guys out to lunch once in a while. Get their feed-back and input on company standards and policies. Do your best to incorporate them. If you can or can't - again - let them know up front or as soon as possible.
Tools is always an issue. Things you should supply are major tools such as ladders, hammer-drills, drill motors (1/2"), power saws, & conduit benders. Small hand tools need to be furnished by the employee including a KO set up to 1 1/4".
1 1/2"-4" KO should be supplied by the company. Cordless drills are a definitely employee tool. You might consider offering a tool account to your employees via net 30 day and set it up for a fixed percentage to be taken out each week before taxes are deducted from their payroll. They pay less tax per paycheck that way. Example: $200.00 tool purchase = $50.00 per week deduction for 4 weeks from GROSS amount.
There's alot more you'll learn on the way to success. Word of Mouth advertising works faster than you think, especially from disgruntled customers and employess.
I've been in the electrical industry for over 20 years and in the estimating/project mgt. field of it for the past 7 years. I've had numerous encounters with irate customers in the past wanting to know things such as "When will you be done", "Why does this cost so much", and so on and on and on.
There's no quick fix answer. The best advice I can offer is to be upfront and honest before they even ask. Keeping customers informed upfront with good and bad news or delays will help them work their schedules better and they'll appreciate your efforts alot more.
Take your guys out to lunch once in a while. Get their feed-back and input on company standards and policies. Do your best to incorporate them. If you can or can't - again - let them know up front or as soon as possible.
Tools is always an issue. Things you should supply are major tools such as ladders, hammer-drills, drill motors (1/2"), power saws, & conduit benders. Small hand tools need to be furnished by the employee including a KO set up to 1 1/4".
1 1/2"-4" KO should be supplied by the company. Cordless drills are a definitely employee tool. You might consider offering a tool account to your employees via net 30 day and set it up for a fixed percentage to be taken out each week before taxes are deducted from their payroll. They pay less tax per paycheck that way. Example: $200.00 tool purchase = $50.00 per week deduction for 4 weeks from GROSS amount.
There's alot more you'll learn on the way to success. Word of Mouth advertising works faster than you think, especially from disgruntled customers and employess.
charlie
Senior Member
- Location
- Indianapolis
Re: Avoiding Mistakes
The tools will belong to them and purchased with their money. The tools are income, please check with your CPA to verify.
I like the idea but you are violating the federal and state tax laws. The only way you can do what you suggest is the flexible spending accounts for medical and child care and the investments into a 401k.
The tools will belong to them and purchased with their money. The tools are income, please check with your CPA to verify.
charlie tuna
Senior Member
- Location
- Florida
Re: Avoiding Mistakes
common sense must be figured into your operation! there are hundreds of "little electrical facits(sp)" in our electrical industry. you must aim at one of these "facits" and set your business up for it! example is "the printing industry". you better have top notch expierianced men working for you, and you better treat them right concerning tools or they will find better employment! the other direction might be "residential". you don't need top notch guys and the tool requirement is reduced and the turn-over ratio is less - but your business headaches are greater because of the mentality of your men and your customers. i have been retired for two weeks after a sucessful run of 25 years for business! i always treated my men by remembering what i expected out of contractors i worked for prior to going into business. i always found that if i provided the proper tools to do the job and kept the materials and information at their fingertips, the job got done with a good profit margine! i fell into the high rise commercial office interior buildouts! then shifted into tenant work and work directly for the building owners, and got away from working for people who didn't pay their bills---mainly general contractors! at one time, more than 60 per cent of our work was computer cabling, and i considered entering that "facit" of our industry. but it required less skill, and eventually, it got too competitive. the higher you set your skill requirement or "facit" the more independent you can be provided you have the people to do the skill! the last five or six years of my career was easy because i could pick and choose who we worked for. customer service must be first and formost, no matter what "facit" you enter! last week, i was introducing another contractor to the owner of a large printing company to take over one of my accounts. the three of us were talking, and the owner wished me luck and stated, "i never-ever questioned your prices, it was more important to me that you showed up when you said you would and in emergencies as soon as possible"! the last job we did for this customer was a six color press--with all the support equipment remotely located---about $40k! time and material!
common sense must be figured into your operation! there are hundreds of "little electrical facits(sp)" in our electrical industry. you must aim at one of these "facits" and set your business up for it! example is "the printing industry". you better have top notch expierianced men working for you, and you better treat them right concerning tools or they will find better employment! the other direction might be "residential". you don't need top notch guys and the tool requirement is reduced and the turn-over ratio is less - but your business headaches are greater because of the mentality of your men and your customers. i have been retired for two weeks after a sucessful run of 25 years for business! i always treated my men by remembering what i expected out of contractors i worked for prior to going into business. i always found that if i provided the proper tools to do the job and kept the materials and information at their fingertips, the job got done with a good profit margine! i fell into the high rise commercial office interior buildouts! then shifted into tenant work and work directly for the building owners, and got away from working for people who didn't pay their bills---mainly general contractors! at one time, more than 60 per cent of our work was computer cabling, and i considered entering that "facit" of our industry. but it required less skill, and eventually, it got too competitive. the higher you set your skill requirement or "facit" the more independent you can be provided you have the people to do the skill! the last five or six years of my career was easy because i could pick and choose who we worked for. customer service must be first and formost, no matter what "facit" you enter! last week, i was introducing another contractor to the owner of a large printing company to take over one of my accounts. the three of us were talking, and the owner wished me luck and stated, "i never-ever questioned your prices, it was more important to me that you showed up when you said you would and in emergencies as soon as possible"! the last job we did for this customer was a six color press--with all the support equipment remotely located---about $40k! time and material!
charlie
Senior Member
- Location
- Indianapolis
Re: Avoiding Mistakes
Charlie Tuna, a reputation is worth its weight in gold and needs to be taken care of like it is gold! Great comments.
Charlie Tuna, a reputation is worth its weight in gold and needs to be taken care of like it is gold! Great comments.
Re: Avoiding Mistakes
Charlie and Charlie tuna,you are both right about the reputation and word of mouth advertising. Anybody starting out needs to keep it in mind. I have been an EC for about 2 years now and my business is growing because I do quality work and have a good personality(according to comments from customers)two things some of my competition evidently lacked as I am getting customers of theirs. The work is out there,do a good job and be honest and the sky is the limit.
Charlie and Charlie tuna,you are both right about the reputation and word of mouth advertising. Anybody starting out needs to keep it in mind. I have been an EC for about 2 years now and my business is growing because I do quality work and have a good personality(according to comments from customers)two things some of my competition evidently lacked as I am getting customers of theirs. The work is out there,do a good job and be honest and the sky is the limit.
Re: Avoiding Mistakes
Great question...
I am in a similar situation...
I agree w/ supplying the larger tools( tuggers, heaters, drills, threaders etc.
I feel that the electricians should have their own benders, cordless drills and hand tools..
dress to work
I supply all saftey gear glasses, gloves,ear plugs hard hats, vests first aid kits, drop lights water jugs shirts etc
I also keep a supply of loaner tools for the young guys starting out that havent quite made a $ investment into their career. If a guy needs a power tool they get all corded tools/ as loaners.
I lknow that when you buy something w/ your own hard earned $ you take better care of it...so i encourage them to do so but also understand that all cant all at once
trucks are another issue.. I issue a truck to those that do or share the maintence shifts. Others will either drive straight to site and work from temp bin depends on the type of work we have going on.
I also would appreciate any experienced words of advice.
Great question...
I am in a similar situation...
I agree w/ supplying the larger tools( tuggers, heaters, drills, threaders etc.
I feel that the electricians should have their own benders, cordless drills and hand tools..
dress to work
I supply all saftey gear glasses, gloves,ear plugs hard hats, vests first aid kits, drop lights water jugs shirts etc
I also keep a supply of loaner tools for the young guys starting out that havent quite made a $ investment into their career. If a guy needs a power tool they get all corded tools/ as loaners.
I lknow that when you buy something w/ your own hard earned $ you take better care of it...so i encourage them to do so but also understand that all cant all at once
trucks are another issue.. I issue a truck to those that do or share the maintence shifts. Others will either drive straight to site and work from temp bin depends on the type of work we have going on.
I also would appreciate any experienced words of advice.
charlie tuna
Senior Member
- Location
- Florida
Re: Avoiding Mistakes
in twenty-five years--working up to 23 men at the peak-- i have lost one battery operated drill motor! i provided all the tools except the hand tools and provided gang boxes to lock everything up at day's end! i was lucky enough to always have money for the tools necessary to do the job! and of course having men who cared for the company's tools and materials!
in twenty-five years--working up to 23 men at the peak-- i have lost one battery operated drill motor! i provided all the tools except the hand tools and provided gang boxes to lock everything up at day's end! i was lucky enough to always have money for the tools necessary to do the job! and of course having men who cared for the company's tools and materials!
charlie
Senior Member
- Location
- Indianapolis
Re: Avoiding Mistakes
Charlie, you are implying that you were lucky to have men that didn't rip you off. I contend that you had the respect and admiration of the men so they wouldn't rip you off. I suspect that you are a good judge of character, hired the best, and treated them right.
Charlie, you are implying that you were lucky to have men that didn't rip you off. I contend that you had the respect and admiration of the men so they wouldn't rip you off. I suspect that you are a good judge of character, hired the best, and treated them right.
pierre
Senior Member
- Location
- Westchester County, New York
Re: Avoiding Mistakes
Charlie Tuna
Congratulations on your retirement!!!!
I hope it is a happy and healthy one
I also hope it does not mean you will leave us?
Pierre
Charlie Tuna
Congratulations on your retirement!!!!
I hope it is a happy and healthy one
I also hope it does not mean you will leave us?
Pierre
- Location
- Massachusetts
Re: Avoiding Mistakes
You sound like a guy I would have enjoyed working for.
I do not own a company, I run small crews from a large work force. I never have trouble getting a good days work out of the guys. I Treat them like I want to be treated, let them have input on the work when possible and remember to have some fun.
Then when the time comes I need them to stay 4 -6 hours late to make a customer happy they will, need them to work outside in miserable weather they do it without complaint as I am out there beside them.
Bob
Congratulations Charlie I hope you have a long healthy retirement.
You sound like a guy I would have enjoyed working for.
I do not own a company, I run small crews from a large work force. I never have trouble getting a good days work out of the guys. I Treat them like I want to be treated, let them have input on the work when possible and remember to have some fun.
Then when the time comes I need them to stay 4 -6 hours late to make a customer happy they will, need them to work outside in miserable weather they do it without complaint as I am out there beside them.
Bob
charlie tuna
Senior Member
- Location
- Florida
Re: Avoiding Mistakes
iwire-bob,
you would never work "for" me. i would love to work "with" you! i may "own" the company--thats only a formality, in realality, the company is owned by all the employees of that company. if more contractors realized that, our trade would be a better place to work.
i was not "just lucky" to have good men who looked out for the company's tools. i provided the best tools available and a method to secure them at day's end, and more important, the time to put everything back where it belonged. i would explain to my fellow workers, "most of the time, the cost of a lost tool is much less than the labor lost recovering from the loss"! one time when i was running a slab on a high rise, someone robbed a drill motor from the gang box on the deck! the foreman from the general contractor replaced it with a new one because he seen how upset the entire electrical crew was over someone we worked with being dishonest!
i don't plan on leaving this webb sight because i'm retired - i owe that to mike holt! he's been part of my business for over twenty years--his knowledge and products have helped my business and fellow employees be successful in the industry!
iwire-bob,
you would never work "for" me. i would love to work "with" you! i may "own" the company--thats only a formality, in realality, the company is owned by all the employees of that company. if more contractors realized that, our trade would be a better place to work.
i was not "just lucky" to have good men who looked out for the company's tools. i provided the best tools available and a method to secure them at day's end, and more important, the time to put everything back where it belonged. i would explain to my fellow workers, "most of the time, the cost of a lost tool is much less than the labor lost recovering from the loss"! one time when i was running a slab on a high rise, someone robbed a drill motor from the gang box on the deck! the foreman from the general contractor replaced it with a new one because he seen how upset the entire electrical crew was over someone we worked with being dishonest!
i don't plan on leaving this webb sight because i'm retired - i owe that to mike holt! he's been part of my business for over twenty years--his knowledge and products have helped my business and fellow employees be successful in the industry!
highkvoltage
Senior Member
Re: Avoiding Mistakes
It is very simple.
Be honest to everyone you deal with, employees and customers.
As the good book saids "Do unto others as you would have others do unto you."
I also have a few other rules no backstabbing, pointing fingers or general fighting/argueing it's not exceptable. We are a team and a team must work together. If there is a problem we are adults and will conduct ourselves as such.
The number 1 rule my job my rules. The door swings one way, my way. I tell my employees there are two ways to look at something my way and God's way we just happen to agree.
It is very simple.
Be honest to everyone you deal with, employees and customers.
As the good book saids "Do unto others as you would have others do unto you."
I also have a few other rules no backstabbing, pointing fingers or general fighting/argueing it's not exceptable. We are a team and a team must work together. If there is a problem we are adults and will conduct ourselves as such.
The number 1 rule my job my rules. The door swings one way, my way. I tell my employees there are two ways to look at something my way and God's way we just happen to agree.
petersonra
Senior Member
- Location
- Northern illinois
- Occupation
- engineer
Re: Avoiding Mistakes
I've dealt with a lot of ECs over the years. From my perspective there are several things you might want to consider.
1. Put things in writing, including confirming verbal communications. This is much easier if both ends of the conversation have email, but can be done by fax or mail. This is not only usefull as a way of keeping track of what was agreed to, but things put in writing tend to be much less likely to be forgotten.
2. Honesty, fairness and integrity go a long ways. Be up front and fair with everyone you deal with. This does not mean you have to tell everyone everything you know, but OTOH its dishonest of you to leave out material facts when you discuss things with someone who is basing their decisions on what you tell them.
If you make a mistake, own up to it and fix it.
3. Keep everyone updated on whats going on. You will get a lot less flack for being a week late if you are honest about it, then if you get to the end date, and then admit you are not going to make it.
4. I personally hate dealing with any contractor who spends as much time nickle and diming me as he does actual work. I realize that most job foreman's bonuses are based on ups and adders, but I hate it when a quotation comes back and there is a list of material on it and the EC thinks if he uses so much as an extra nut or bolt that its on me.
Its up to the EC to go out and look at the site and realize that he might have to rent some equipment to be able to do what he needs. Its also his problem to arrange for toilet facilities, storage areas, etc. And I am not responsible for downtime caused by the plant safety people not allowing the EC to work because none of them have appropriate PPE.
If you don't have enough information to bid the job just say so, and we can do it on a T&M basis, or get you enough info to be able to bid it.
Its also up to the EC to actually read the spec. If there are questions about the spec, ask them before you bid. Don't try to get an adder cause you thought you could get by with something less than what the spec requires. Personally, I don't always chose the low bidder (if its up to me), especially if they are way low. That shows me they have forgotten something big or plan to kill me on change orders.
5. I have dealt with a lot of ECs whose people cannot read even simple control schematics. This is troubling to me, but VERY common. If you and/or your people cannot understand the drawings, call me and we can have a teleconference with you and go over the drawings upfront, so I don't spend a week trying to fix it later on.
I've dealt with a lot of ECs over the years. From my perspective there are several things you might want to consider.
1. Put things in writing, including confirming verbal communications. This is much easier if both ends of the conversation have email, but can be done by fax or mail. This is not only usefull as a way of keeping track of what was agreed to, but things put in writing tend to be much less likely to be forgotten.
2. Honesty, fairness and integrity go a long ways. Be up front and fair with everyone you deal with. This does not mean you have to tell everyone everything you know, but OTOH its dishonest of you to leave out material facts when you discuss things with someone who is basing their decisions on what you tell them.
If you make a mistake, own up to it and fix it.
3. Keep everyone updated on whats going on. You will get a lot less flack for being a week late if you are honest about it, then if you get to the end date, and then admit you are not going to make it.
4. I personally hate dealing with any contractor who spends as much time nickle and diming me as he does actual work. I realize that most job foreman's bonuses are based on ups and adders, but I hate it when a quotation comes back and there is a list of material on it and the EC thinks if he uses so much as an extra nut or bolt that its on me.
Its up to the EC to go out and look at the site and realize that he might have to rent some equipment to be able to do what he needs. Its also his problem to arrange for toilet facilities, storage areas, etc. And I am not responsible for downtime caused by the plant safety people not allowing the EC to work because none of them have appropriate PPE.
If you don't have enough information to bid the job just say so, and we can do it on a T&M basis, or get you enough info to be able to bid it.
Its also up to the EC to actually read the spec. If there are questions about the spec, ask them before you bid. Don't try to get an adder cause you thought you could get by with something less than what the spec requires. Personally, I don't always chose the low bidder (if its up to me), especially if they are way low. That shows me they have forgotten something big or plan to kill me on change orders.
5. I have dealt with a lot of ECs whose people cannot read even simple control schematics. This is troubling to me, but VERY common. If you and/or your people cannot understand the drawings, call me and we can have a teleconference with you and go over the drawings upfront, so I don't spend a week trying to fix it later on.
iggy2
Senior Member
- Location
- NEw England
Re: Avoiding Mistakes
After 7 relatively successful years owning an engineering corp.:
1. Don't have too fancy an office.
2. Don't drive too fancy a car.
3. Keep your employees happy, and the bottom line will take care of itself.
After 7 relatively successful years owning an engineering corp.:
1. Don't have too fancy an office.
2. Don't drive too fancy a car.
3. Keep your employees happy, and the bottom line will take care of itself.
- Status