13.2 - 480 (NJ guys)

nickelec

Senior Member
Location
US
Good afternoon all i need some assistance/ guidance here , i have a project in a pretty remote part of south jersey where we need about 1200 amps

long story short pseg is telling me the only thing they can provide me with is 13.2 and i would need to step it down from there , the problem is i have never worked with anything this large

1 . does this transformer need to be in a room or pad mount is ok
2. im assuming pseg will hook up the primary side ?
3. would pseg or an poco for that matter require certain certifications for high voltage?
4. what is required by the nec on the secondary side? just a single service disconnect feeding the new 480 1200 amp service?
5 where would one even go to purchase a transformer like this or should poco be suppling this?

any feedback would be greatly apricated
 

hillbilly1

Senior Member
Location
Atlanta,Ga
Occupation
Field coordinator/ technical support
1200 amp is pretty common, so the poco must be balking because in that rural area, they would have to keep a spare sitting at the depot. Is this a deregulated area? That may be another reason they want you to supply your own. If so usually they want an isolation switch that they can disconnect your transformer if something goes wrong.
 

don_resqcapt19

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Illinois
Occupation
retired electrician
1) I would prefer a pad mount
2) Unlikely that the utility would hook up the primary. The service point will be on the line side of the transformer, and you will have to provide the service disconnect which will be at 13.2kV
3)If you are asking about the certifications for your employees that is up to you.
4)The service disconnect will be on the 13.kV side. The NEC will require protection for the transformer as found in 450.3 and will require a building disconnect.
5) many supply house can supply the transformer...and you may be able to buy direct from a manufacturer.

It sounds like you may be in over your head and and you may need to partner with another contractor who routinely does high voltage work for the primary/service disconnect, primary conductors and transformer installation. You many also be required to supply engineered drawings to the utility.
 

infinity

Moderator
Staff member
Location
New Jersey
Occupation
Journeyman Electrician
Good afternoon all i need some assistance/ guidance here , i have a project in a pretty remote part of south jersey where we need about 1200 amps
Are you the engineer? (please update your profile) For something like this an experienced engineer is probably needed. They should be familiar with both the NEC and the POCO requirements.
 

nickelec

Senior Member
Location
US
1) I would prefer a pad mount
2) Unlikely that the utility would hook up the primary. The service point will be on the line side of the transformer, and you will have to provide the service disconnect which will be at 13.2kV
3)If you are asking about the certifications for your employees that is up to you.
4)The service disconnect will be on the 13.kV side. The NEC will require protection for the transformer as found in 450.3 and will require a building disconnect.
5) many supply house can supply the transformer...and you may be able to buy direct from a manufacturer.

It sounds like you may be in over your head and and you may need to partner with another contractor who routinely does high voltage work for the primary/service disconnect, primary conductors and transformer installation. You many also be required to supply engineered drawings to the utility.
I completely agree with you on this . Any recommendations for guys in the nj area?

Engineering is working on drawings I jsut wanted to get some info for myself.

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nickelec

Senior Member
Location
US
Are you the engineer? (please update your profile) For something like this an experienced engineer is probably needed. They should be familiar with both the NEC and the POCO requirements.
No I'm not and engineer I'm a contractor andb do have an engineer working on the project . As mentioned I'm jsut looking for some general info so I know how to progress.

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ron

Senior Member
Good afternoon all i need some assistance/ guidance here , i have a project in a pretty remote part of south jersey where we need about 1200 amps

long story short pseg is telling me the only thing they can provide me with is 13.2 and i would need to step it down from there , the problem is i have never worked with anything this large

1 . does this transformer need to be in a room or pad mount is ok
2. im assuming pseg will hook up the primary side ?
3. would pseg or an poco for that matter require certain certifications for high voltage?
4. what is required by the nec on the secondary side? just a single service disconnect feeding the new 480 1200 amp service?
5 where would one even go to purchase a transformer like this or should poco be suppling this?

any feedback would be greatly apricated
1. Exterior or interior is fine either way. It can be a substation type if it is protected from the general public, but padmount is ok too (everything is concealed and entry/exit is bottom). Dry type or liquid filled is fine either interior or exterior. Generally if it is interior, the liquid filled would be seed oil (FR3).
2. PSEG will likely require a disconnect and meter on the primary side, then it is on you to extend to your transformer.
3. PSEG often has specs up to their meter / disconnect. They may also require a surge arrestor with certain characteristics.
4. The NEC for this application is no different than in other low voltage secondary. One option you may not be familiar with is 240.21(C)(4) for unlimited secondary length if it is outside.
5. The poco is giving you a primary service because you would buy the transformer. Most major transformer manuf makes these 1MVA transformers. ABB, Eaton, Hammond, etc.
 
Something doesn't seem right to me, I wonder if there is more to the story. They are saying they will ONLY provide you primary service for 480 1200A? Just curious, has anyone else heard of such a thing for such a "small" service?
 

nickelec

Senior Member
Location
US
From what they're telling me it has to do with the location of the property

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nickelec

Senior Member
Location
US
That could be possible it's on a big swath of private land that's not really easily accessible you may be on to something

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hillbilly1

Senior Member
Location
Atlanta,Ga
Occupation
Field coordinator/ technical support
The first school I wired, the poco would not set a pad mount for the 2000 amp service, they said they would have to keep a spare in the yard, so they put three pole mounts in an enclosure on a slab. Could be a deregulated area, customer must buy the transformer and supply the high line to the pole. We have done that in areas of Kentucky, and Virginia, I think. In deregulated areas, even the residential transformers can be owned by the homeowner.
 
What would an NEC compliant 15kv class service disconnect look like? Could that be a fused cut out mounted on a pole like the Poco would use? The problem for me with medium voltage is I just don't know the terms jargon and equipment. I have done step up step down Transformers with medium voltage on the high side and thats no sweat because pretty much the only MV equipment you need is load break elbows. But if I needed an MV service disconnect I wouldn't know what to get.
 

nickelec

Senior Member
Location
US
This is my issue as well that's y I'm probably going to look a for guy that does alot of HV stuff and I'll take it from the switches provided

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don_resqcapt19

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Illinois
Occupation
retired electrician
What would an NEC compliant 15kv class service disconnect look like? Could that be a fused cut out mounted on a pole like the Poco would use? The problem for me with medium voltage is I just don't know the terms jargon and equipment. I have done step up step down Transformers with medium voltage on the high side and thats no sweat because pretty much the only MV equipment you need is load break elbows. But if I needed an MV service disconnect I wouldn't know what to get.
It can be, but only if the cutouts are gang operated, and operable from the bottom of the pole. 230.204(B) and 230.205(A).
 

ron

Senior Member
I doubt the pole mounted stuff is NRTL (UL) listed.
For 15kV class switches, when I am able to use fuses (often I have to use breakers for resetability), I specify metal clad switchgear with fused switches, or if I'm being fancy a pad mount G&W or S&C SF6 switchgear switch.
 

don_resqcapt19

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Illinois
Occupation
retired electrician
I doubt the pole mounted stuff is NRTL (UL) listed.
For 15kV class switches, when I am able to use fuses (often I have to use breakers for resetability), I specify metal clad switchgear with fused switches, or if I'm being fancy a pad mount G&W or S&C SF6 switchgear switch.
What would require the pole stuff to be listed?
 
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