main service disconnect

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stephen fox

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boston
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electrician
as per the new code requiring emergency disconnect outside the local inspector told me i did not have to separate grounds and neutrals if the panel is in close proximity on the inside of main panel
just wanna make sure that's correct only reason I'm asking the question is because the panel is already a 200 amp panel but the outside has to upgrades

going from 100amp to 200amp single family house
 
infinity

infinity

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Is it going to be the service disconnect or an emergency disconnect?

Welcome to the Forum. :)
 
Greentagger

Greentagger

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Texas
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Master Electrician, Electrical Inspector
I believe that is why you have been given two options of labeling. Either as service disconnect or not. If I’m not mistaken, the GEC and bonding can remain as is in the existing service panel. You still must bond the grounded conductor (neutral) at the new emergency disconnect. Don’t forget your SPD.
 
Dsg319

Dsg319

Senior Member
Location
West Virginia
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Wv Master “lectrician”
shortcircuit2 said:
If the outside disconnect is listed and labeled as Suitable for Use Only as Service Equipment ...you should be installing it as such.
Click to expand...

I’ve been pondering on this. Could one use a meter with a 200amp breaker main outside and classify as an emergency disconnect? Or does it have to state somewhere on it specifically for emergencies.
 
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stephen fox

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Location
boston
Occupation
electrician
stephen fox said:
as per the new code requiring emergency disconnect outside the local inspector told me i did not have to separate grounds and neutrals if the panel is in close proximity on the inside of main panel
just wanna make sure that's correct only reason I'm asking the question is because the panel is already a 200 amp panel but the outside has to upgrades

going from 100amp to 200amp single family house
Click to expand...
Outside I’m putting a 200 amp meter main one enclosure
 
infinity

infinity

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Location
New Jersey
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Journeyman Electrician
stephen fox said:
Why is inspector saying I don’t have to separate
Click to expand...
Maybe he's thinking that you would label the meter main the emergency disconnect not service equipment and let the main in the panel be the service disconnect. Will the GEC(s) still land in the panel?

230.85 Emergency Disconnects.
For one- and two-family dwelling units, all service conductors shall terminate in disconnecting means having a short-circuit current rating equal to or greater than the available fault current, installed in a readily accessible outdoor location. If more than one disconnect is provided, they shall be grouped. Each disconnect shall be one of the following:
(1) Service disconnects marked as follows:
EMERGENCY DISCONNECT,
SERVICE DISCONNECT
(2) Meter disconnects installed per 230.82(3) and marked as follows:
EMERGENCY DISCONNECT,
METER DISCONNECT,
NOT SERVICE EQUIPMENT
(3) Other listed disconnect switches or circuit breakers on the supply side of each service disconnect that are suitable for use as service equipment and marked as follows:
EMERGENCY DISCONNECT,
NOT SERVICE EQUIPMENT
Markings shall comply with 110.21(B).
Click to expand...
 
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Hv&Lv

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-
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infinity said:
Maybe he's thinking that you would label the meter main the emergency disconnect not service equipment and let the main in the panel be the service disconnect. Will the GEC(s) still land in the panel?
Click to expand...
So to check myself here, I need to separate for 1), but for 2) & 3), I don’t have to separate.
 
Greentagger

Greentagger

Senior Member
Location
Texas
Occupation
Master Electrician, Electrical Inspector
Correct. Exterior disconnect all 3 applications neutral to be bonded to case just like a meter base.
 
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stephen fox

Member
Location
boston
Occupation
electrician
stephen fox said:
as per the new code requiring emergency disconnect outside the local inspector told me i did not have to separate grounds and neutrals if the panel is in close proximity on the inside of main panel
just wanna make sure that's correct only reason I'm asking the question is because the panel is already a 200 amp panel but the outside has to upgrades

going from 100amp to 200amp single family house
Click to expand...
stephen fox said:
Outside I’m putting a 200 amp meter main one enclosure
Click to expand...
infinity said:
Maybe he's thinking that you would label the meter main the emergency disconnect not service equipment and let the main in the panel be the service disconnect. Will the GEC(s) still land in the panel?
Click to expand...
why is it so complicated either you have to separate or you don’t
The panel inside is literally 3 feet away it’s not a sub panel
 
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stephen fox

Member
Location
boston
Occupation
electrician
He also said the water meter ground can terminate at the panel
Not the meter main
Obviously the ground rods will terminate at meter main
 
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shortcircuit2

Senior Member
Location
South of Bawstin
stephen fox said:
why is it so complicated either you have to separate or you don’t
The panel inside is literally 3 feet away it’s not a sub panel
Click to expand...
Distribution Equipment (sub-panel) can be adjacent to Service Equipment and requires a separate insulated grounded conductor and separate equipment grounding conductor. Distance is irrelevant.
 
ritelec

ritelec

Senior Member
Location
Jersey
stephen fox said:
He also said the water meter ground can terminate at the panel
Not the meter main
Obviously the ground rods will terminate at meter main
Click to expand...
Ground rods terminate at the "FIRST OVERCURRENT PROTECTION".
Inside or outside your SERVICE main needs bonding and grounding. Anything else after is separate neutral and ground.
If your emergency disconnect has OVERCURRENT protection it is your service disconnect also. If your emergency disconnect is just a switch with NO overcurrent protection it is not your service disconnect.
 
Last edited:
infinity

infinity

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Staff member
Location
New Jersey
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Journeyman Electrician
Where is the main bonding jumper installed? If it's at the meter main then the panel is a sub-panel. If it's at the panel then with proper labeling you will comply with 230.85(3).
 
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