GFI within 6’ of sink
- Thread starter jusme123
- Start date
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hbiss
EC, Westchester, New York NEC: 2014
- Location
- Hawthorne, New York NEC: 2014
- Occupation
- EC
There are big bathrooms you know.
-Hal
-Hal
- Location
- Chapel Hill, NC
- Occupation
- Retired Electrical Contractor
Their intent was to include the receptacle in another room if it was within 6' of the sink
- Location
- Tennessee NEC:2017
- Occupation
- Semi-Retired Electrician
Their intent is stupid IMO!
I would like to see evidence for their justification. Probably a "what if" thing!
LarryFine
Master Electrician Electric Contractor Richmond VA
- Location
- Henrico County, VA
- Occupation
- Electrical Contractor
Any device with a 6' cord.
kwired
Electron manager
- Location
- NE Nebraska
I don't see this one being all that hard to avoid. Even if the basin edge is about right at the edge of the door, your nearest receptacle in the bedroom must be no more than 6 feet from the door. Chances are you can still have right at 6 feet from the door plus a few extra inches to the sink.
jimport
Senior Member
- Location
- Outside Baltimore Maryland
- Occupation
- Master Electrician
Which is really handy running a cord through a door when trying to get ready with the door closed.
kwired
Electron manager
- Location
- NE Nebraska
I agree it is somewhat overkill, but certainly not high on my list of bad changes.
My point was not how to avoid it, but why do I need a gfi in the bedroom when it’s 4’ from bathroom door, crazy IMO
jimport
Senior Member
- Location
- Outside Baltimore Maryland
- Occupation
- Master Electrician
Like there was no real thought put into the implementation of the rule and practical application.
kwired
Electron manager
- Location
- NE Nebraska
It should mostly only be an issue if the sink is really close to the door. But even then a lot of the time at least 3 to 4 feet of the 6 feet from the sink is already used up before you get to the door and that means you might need that first outlet in the bedroom at least 2 or 3 feet from the door.
Like I said somewhat overkill but would be willing to leave that one in code if they would change some other things I don't care for.
ptonsparky
Tom
- Occupation
- EC - retired
Throw out the AFCIs, GFCI or GFPE (30 ma) everything. Simple
IMO, they are heading toward combo Arc fault/GFI breakers for entire panel, because it’s what the manufactures want.
readydave8
re member
- Location
- Clarkesville, Georgia
- Occupation
- electrician
due to unfortunate naming of series/parallel breakers, I've been trying to force myself to say "dual function", still having to pause and think every time
Ohno Raccoon
Member
- Location
- Fairfax, VA
Can you point out the NEC reference that you're talking about? I don't see what the question is. I'm looking at 2011 and the way it's written a receptacle within 6ft of the sink (regardless of being in another room). What changed?
Why would you put a GFI in the bedroom if it's within 4' from the bathroom door? I don't know. If it's within 6' of the bathroom sink. Then I would say because it's possible for someone to have a device plugged into that outlet and drop it in the sink without the need for an extension cord.
kwired
Electron manager
- Location
- NE Nebraska
Prior to 2017 edition, you are correct with the way it is written that receptacle in the bedroom would need GFCI protection if within 6 feet of the bath sink.
2017 they added wording in 210.8 before subpart (A) that clarifies how to measure distance when needed. ..passing through a door would be one thing that does not count in determining that distance, so with 2017 you can have bath sink right next to door and bedroom receptacle on back side of wall and well within 6 feet of sink, but passing through door to make the measurement. As worded does not need GFCI protection, prior to 2017 kind of must assume that you must measure through the door.
Ohno Raccoon
Member
- Location
- Fairfax, VA
Ok, thank you for pointing out the paragraph. I was just looking between NEC 2020 and some versions prior to 2017 for comparison. So I did not see the reference to the door as you have pointed out in 2017. Does that doorway/door verbiage only exist in the 2017 version?
It appears they removed the reference to doors and doorways in 2020 as the OP suggested. So let's say there is a bathroom sink that is located at the door and a receptacle without GFCI protection located on the wall just outside of the door (within 6' cord length). This installation would only be allowable per NEC 2017, correct?
kwired
Electron manager
- Location
- NE Nebraska
I see they have nearly identical wording in 2020 but removed the word "door/doorway" .
I recall before 2017 it was not clear how to measure the distance in situations like this and some AHJ's would require GFCI for say a receptacle in kitchen cabinet that is within 6 feet of sink and others would not. Then they added that wording in 2017 to clarify how to make the measurement, and excluded situations where the cord would have to pass through a door, window etc.
Now it looks like the door was taken out but the window was not, so apparently if using 2020 OP would need GFCI for that bedroom receptacle if it is within 6 feet of bathroom sink even with the door way being there, but you would measure the distance along the wall and through the doorway but definitely not use a straight line that passes through the wall.
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