2020 GFCI requirements

Merry Christmas

JoeNorm

Senior Member
Location
WA
My question concerns a couple specifics. It is my understanding that any outdoor outlet has to be GFCI protected now including RV hookups.

But won't this cause plenty of issues seeing as the RV may already have GFCI's installed throughout? Or will this not be an issue?

Same goes for EV chargers, many say in the manual to not put on a GFCI breaker because they already have it internally. So does that eliminate the option of being able to have a cord and plug install if the receptacle is outdoors or in a garage?

thanks
 

mbrooke

Batteries Included
Location
United States
Occupation
Technician
GFCIs in series with other GFCIs should not cause a problem.

Some issue will probably crop up due to leakage currents since all the wiring on the RV is protected, but as the saying goes time will tell.
 

don_resqcapt19

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Illinois
Occupation
retired electrician
There is no issue with GFCIs being on the load side of another GFCI, other than never knowing which one will trip. On a ground fault on the load side of the second GFCI, either one or the GFCIs or both may trip.

Manufacturer's instructions cannot over ride a code rule that requires GFCI protection for the outlet that the equipment is connected to.

As far as the charger, the rules for GFCI protection inside a garage only apply to receptacles so they would not apply to a hard wired vehicle charger.

The requirement for outside GFCI protection at dwelling units requires that the "outlet" have GFCI protection, so it applies to both hard wired and cord and plug connected equipment.
 

retirede

Senior Member
Location
Illinois
There is no issue with GFCIs being on the load side of another GFCI, other than never knowing which one will trip. On a ground fault on the load side of the second GFCI, either one or the GFCIs or both may trip.

Manufacturer's instructions cannot over ride a code rule that requires GFCI protection for the outlet that the equipment is connected to.

As far as the charger, the rules for GFCI protection inside a garage only apply to receptacles so they would not apply to a hard wired vehicle charger.

The requirement for outside GFCI protection at dwelling units requires that the "outlet" have GFCI protection, so it applies to both hard wired and cord and plug connected equipment.

To go further, every cord and plug connected EVSE I am familiar with says that the circuit should be GFCI protected and every hard wired one says not to provide external GFCI.

Not saying there aren’t others out there that don’t follow this trend.

The hard wired, when installed outside, do pose a conflict under 2020.
 

JoeNorm

Senior Member
Location
WA
Thanks. I don't know why I thought a GFI fed by another GFI will cause problems. Good to know that it likely will not.
 

don_resqcapt19

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Illinois
Occupation
retired electrician
To go further, every cord and plug connected EVSE I am familiar with says that the circuit should be GFCI protected and every hard wired one says not to provide external GFCI.

Not saying there aren’t others out there that don’t follow this trend.

The hard wired, when installed outside, do pose a conflict under 2020.
I don't see a conflict, where the code requires something that the instructions say not to do, the code always rules. Instructions cannot eliminate a code requirement. They can add to what the code requires, but they cannot delete a protection required by the code.
 

retirede

Senior Member
Location
Illinois
I don't see a conflict, where the code requires something that the instructions say not to do, the code always rules. Instructions cannot eliminate a code requirement. They can add to what the code requires, but they cannot delete a protection required by the code.

My point is that the instructions conflict with the code…as you state, code wins, but that doesn’t mean there isn’t a conflict.
 

marmathsen

Senior Member
Location
Seattle, Wa ...ish
Occupation
Electrical Contractor
The requirement for outside GFCI protection at dwelling units requires that the "outlet" have GFCI protection, so it applies to both hard wired and cord and plug connected equipment.

I know this is an older post but correct my if I'm wrong in that this would only apply to circuits that are ≤50A, right?

I'm thinking specifically about the Tesla Wall Connector that can be fused at 60A. The instructions state not the GFCI protect upstream.

Rob G
 

Dennis Alwon

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Chapel Hill, NC
Occupation
Retired Electrical Contractor
I know this is an older post but correct my if I'm wrong in that this would only apply to circuits that are ≤50A, right?

I'm thinking specifically about the Tesla Wall Connector that can be fused at 60A. The instructions state not the GFCI protect upstream.

Rob G


Here is your answer based on 2020 nec

625.54 Ground-Fault Circuit-Interrupter Protection for Personnel.



In addition to the requirements in 210.8, all receptacles installed for the connection of electric vehicle charging shall have ground-fault circuit-interrupter protection for personnel.
ENHANCED CONTENT
Portable and fastened-in-place EVSE that is permitted to be cord-and plug-connected must be supplied through a GFCI-protected receptacle. This includes all the single- and three-phase receptacle configurations specified in 625.44(A) and (B). The outlet supplying direct-connected EVSE is not required to be GFCI protected unless specified in the manufacturer’s instructions.
 

retirede

Senior Member
Location
Illinois
I know this is an older post but correct my if I'm wrong in that this would only apply to circuits that are ≤50A, right?

I'm thinking specifically about the Tesla Wall Connector that can be fused at 60A. The instructions state not the GFCI protect upstream.

Rob G

EVSE receptacle outlets are limited to 50A. Above that, they must be hard-wired. I believe it’s in 625.60.

ETA - that’s not the correct section, I’ll try to find the right one.
 
Last edited:

marmathsen

Senior Member
Location
Seattle, Wa ...ish
Occupation
Electrical Contractor
Here is your answer based on 2020 nec

625.54 Ground-Fault Circuit-Interrupter Protection for Personnel.
ENHANCED CONTENT
Portable and fastened-in-place EVSE that is permitted to be cord-and plug-connected must be supplied through a GFCI-protected receptacle. This includes all the single- and three-phase receptacle configurations specified in 625.44(A) and (B). The outlet supplying direct-connected EVSE is not required to be GFCI protected unless specified in the manufacturer’s instructions.
Yeah I had seen the commentary but it seemed to contradict 210.8(F). And since the commentary isn't technically the code, I obviously defer to the code when there is a conflict.

210.8(F) Outdoor Outlets.

All outdoor outlets for dwellings, other than those covered in 210.8(A)(3), Exception to (3), that are supplied by single-phase branch circuits rated 150 volts to ground or less, 50 amperes or less, shall have ground-fault circuit-interrupter protection for personnel. This requirement shall become effective on January 1, 2023 for mini-split-type heating/ventilating/air-conditioning (HVAC) equipment and other HVAC units employing power conversion equipment as a means to control compressor speed.

Informational Note:
Power conversion equipment is the term used to describe the components used in HVAC equipment that is commonly referred to as a variable speed drive. The use of power conversion equipment to control compressor speed differs from multistage compressor speed control.


Exception:
Ground-fault circuit-interrupter protection shall not be required on lighting outlets other than those covered in 210.8(C).

Enhanced Content
Outdoor receptacle outlet requirements for dwelling units are covered in 210.8(A)(3). This requirement covers other outdoor outlets, such as an appliance outlet for the connection of air-conditioning equipment.
 

wwhitney

Senior Member
Location
Berkeley, CA
Occupation
Retired
Yeah I had seen the commentary but it seemed to contradict 210.8(F).
[Your link only works for those with NFPA Link subscriptions.]

I don't see any contradictions in the 2020 NEC. For a dwelling unit EVSE, there are 8 potential cases depending on indoor/outdoor, circuit rated <= 50 amps or >50 amps, and hardwired or cord and plug connected. Then:

Indoor/Plug/<=50 amps : GFCI required by 625.54, and 210.8(A)(2) if in a garage
Indoor/Plug/>50 amps: prohibited case, 625.44
Indoor/Hardwire/<=50 amps: no GFCI required
Indoor/Hardware/>50 amps: no GFCI required
Outdoor/Plug/<=50 amps: GFCI required by 625.54, 210.8(A)(3), and 210.8(F)
Outdoor/Plug/>50 amps: prohibited case, 625.44
Outdoor/Hardwire/<=50 amps: GFCI required by 210.8(F)
Outdoor/Hardwire/>50 amps: no GFCI required

I.e. GFCI is required unless the EVSE is hardwired and either (a) indoors or (b) on a circuit over 50A.

Cheers, Wayne
 

marmathsen

Senior Member
Location
Seattle, Wa ...ish
Occupation
Electrical Contractor
[Your link only works for those with NFPA Link subscriptions.]

I don't see any contradictions in the 2020 NEC. For a dwelling unit EVSE, there are 8 potential cases depending on indoor/outdoor, circuit rated <= 50 amps or >50 amps, and hardwired or cord and plug connected. Then:

Indoor/Plug/<=50 amps : GFCI required by 625.54, and 210.8(A)(2) if in a garage
Indoor/Plug/>50 amps: prohibited case, 625.44
Indoor/Hardwire/<=50 amps: no GFCI required
Indoor/Hardware/>50 amps: no GFCI required
Outdoor/Plug/<=50 amps: GFCI required by 625.54, 210.8(A)(3), and 210.8(F)
Outdoor/Plug/>50 amps: prohibited case, 625.44
Outdoor/Hardwire/<=50 amps: GFCI required by 210.8(F)
Outdoor/Hardwire/>50 amps: no GFCI required

I.e. GFCI is required unless the EVSE is hardwired and either (a) indoors or (b) on a circuit over 50A.

Cheers, Wayne
The contradiction is in the commentary to 625.54 which states, "The outlet supplying direct-connected EVSE is not required to be GFCI protected unless specified in the manufacturer’s instructions."

But as I mentioned in post #12 I'm forced to defer to the actual code over commentary when there is a conflict.
 

Dennis Alwon

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Chapel Hill, NC
Occupation
Retired Electrical Contractor
The contradiction is in the commentary to 625.54 which states, "The outlet supplying direct-connected EVSE is not required to be GFCI protected unless specified in the manufacturer’s instructions."

But as I mentioned in post #12 I'm forced to defer to the actual code over commentary when there is a conflict.

The commentary is from the code panel members who wrote that section. They are interpreting it for us.
 

Phillip Land

Member
Location
Rome, Ga, US
To go further, every cord and plug connected EVSE I am familiar with says that the circuit should be GFCI protected and every hard wired one says not to provide external GFCI.

Not saying there aren’t others out there that don’t follow this trend.

The hard wired, when installed outside, do pose a conflict under 2020.
How would it conflict if there is already Gfci protection built in like the Tesla level 3 wallcharger?
If the customer wants a receptacle then I install an appropriate gfci breaker
 
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