Wiring Question

[JFletcher]

Today we had a call for a ceiling fan not working. Traced the problem to an open neutral in an attic j-box. The interesting thing is that the ceiling fan's original neutral had been 'borrowed' for a lighting circuit, and the fan had another neutral (via 14/2 NM) run to it from a different location (the failed attic jbox) than the original switch. I dont think this is legal under any recent code cycle (power coming from point A and neutral coming from point B - conductors not grouped together), but this install appeared 'fairly' old (mid 70s would be my guess). I know that setup is common with K&T wiring, never seen it with NM. Was this ever legal, and, aside from a minor tracing nightmare, what other problems could this setup create?

 

[donselec]

Well if any of the circuits were put on an arc-fault breaker it would be a problem, but you're right all the circuit conductors for a circuit should be grouped together and the neutrals shouldn't be used for other circuits.

 

[GerryB]

Well if any of the circuits were put on an arc-fault breaker it would be a problem, but you're right all the circuit conductors for a circuit should be grouped together and the neutrals shouldn't be used for other circuits.

Could be the neutral failed some other time and another elec ran a second one because he couldn't find it, if I'm understanding the post right.

 

[JFletcher]

Could be the neutral failed some other time and another elec ran a second one because he couldn't find it, if I'm understanding the post right.

The original ceiling fan neutral had been used as a switchleg for the lights, and there was an additional 14/2 in the ceiling fan box providing the neutral to the fan from another circuit. All I could figure is the light switchleg was missed at rough-in and someone took the easy way out rather than cutting apart finished walls to fish in a new cable.

Forgot about AFCI breakers being a problem with this setup, unless the wires of the different circuits were also changed in the panel.

 

[augie47]

Among other issues I think 300.3(B) and 200.4 would play a role

 

[ActionDave]

....Was this ever legal,

No.

aside from a minor tracing nightmare, what other problems could this setup create?

The nasty shock you can get and a fall from a ladder when you open up the neutral connection that has been bootlegged even though you turned the circuit off and tested with you meter.

 

[jap]

Could be the neutral failed some other time and another elec ran a second one because he couldn't find it, if I'm understanding the post right.

Sounds like they may have originally brought power to the switch first and nothing more than a 12/2 from the switch the ceiling box with ran both the light and the fan at the same time.

Then later on they wanted the fan and the light to be switched separately so they used the white that was existing for the other switch leg and went hunting for a new neutral from somewhere else to take it's place.

Look at the bright side.

At least they didn't make the swap and use the EGC as a neutral like so many have done in the past.

JAP>