Solar Question(s) from a "Green Horn"

[Little Bill]

I got a call from a guy asking if I could wire some circuits into a panel from a solar panel.
He said he just wanted me to mainly terminate the wires to the breakers in the panel.

I told him I didn't really have any experience with solar, especially all the codes involved.
He said it was a stand alone system, just a few circuits he wanted to power from the solar panel. He said there would be no grid tie.
I thought maybe I could do that but thought I better question him further. So I ask again if he was going to tie into the grid.

Glad I did because he said not now, but wanted a way to transfer to the grid should he need to. I told him that opened up a different set of circumstances all together.
I think he wants to put in a transfer switch (probably ATS) at some point.

My question is, in a nut shell, what would need to be done to do this right and code compliant. I know I need to read up on the requirements in the NEC, but thought someone could point me in the right direction should I decide to do this project.

I don't think his intentions are to sell back any power, just have enough to power the few circuits he wants in a separate panel.

Or should I run from this not knowing for sure his intentions?
My feelings are he wants something done cheap, fast, and easy. Not considering what all would be involved.

 

[SolarPro]

Sounds like a project/customer to steer clear of.

If you want to learn about stand-alone and grid-tied PV system design and installation, Solar Energy International has some great programs for that:

http://www.solarenergy.org/

Home Power magazine is another good resource:

http://www.homepower.com/

Here's a link a HP primer RE: basic PV system types:

http://www.homepower.com/articles/pv-systems-simplified

 

[Little Bill]

Sounds like a project/customer to steer clear of.

If you want to learn about stand-alone and grid-tied PV system design and installation, Solar Energy International has some great programs for that:

http://www.solarenergy.org/

Home Power magazine is another good resource:

http://www.homepower.com/

Here's a link a HP primer RE: basic PV system types:

http://www.homepower.com/articles/pv-systems-simplified

Thanks! I'll do some reading with the links provided!

 

[GoldDigger]

I got a call from a guy asking if I could wire some circuits into a panel from a solar panel.
He said he just wanted me to mainly terminate the wires to the breakers in the panel.

If you have no idea who installed the rest of the system (from the solar panels through an inverter to a sub-panel for AC loads) or whether it was done properly, just connecting a few appliances or branch circuits to that panel may be easy but it puts you in the spotlight if anything is wrong somewhere else.

There are two basic kinds of inverters,
1. the off-grid inverter which is an SDS, running from the battery bank which is charged by the solar panels. You can combine that will some form of transfer switch to allow a load to run from one or the other. Or you can just dedicate certain loads to it only. No connection to house wiring at all.
2. The grid tied inverter, with no batteries and a backfed breaker into the grid. He apparently does not have that.
and one not so basic,
3. the Hybrid system. This combines aspects of both and is much more interesting to design. I doubt he has one of those.

Assuming that all the rest of the system is code compliant and will not be grid connected (no connection or a load transfer switch only) then the code issues in wiring up the loads themselves are nothing special. But that is a big assumption.
Unless you are interested in learning a lot before the job is done, I would give you the same advice that SolarPro did.

 

[macmikeman]

I got questions about non grid tie systems when there is also a regular poco service at the same dwelling. Fireman pulls up, thinks he is killing all power in the house when he turns off the main breaker, and possibly gets a shocking education if that isn't made obvious with a plaque at the main electrical service of the house. I came across a swimming pool setup like that last week. A German guy has dc pv panels running his German made pool pump controller, and there is no utility connections to that circuit. The panels and the pool control system is remote from the main service of the house, and no indications at either end about the "other" service means.

 

[GoldDigger]

I got questions about non grid tie systems when there is also a regular poco service at the same dwelling. Fireman pulls up, thinks he is killing all power in the house when he turns off the main breaker, and possibly gets a shocking education if that isn't made obvious with a plaque at the main electrical service of the house. I came across a swimming pool setup like that last week. A German guy has dc pv panels running his German made pool pump controller, and there is no utility connections to that circuit. The panels and the pool control system is remote from the main service of the house, and no indications at either end about the "other" service means.

If the wiring comes into the house, there should be a sign to that effect at a disconnect which handles just that system, as well as an advisory sign telling where that disconnect is. Maybe not required by code if it uses entirely separate wiring (comments?), but definitely common sense.
If the solar system only powers something like a pool pump which is entirely outside the house, I would hope to still see a disconnect for it near the pump and/or near the batteries and inverter, and again a sign at the service disconnect indicating where they are.

 

[ggunn]

I got a call from a guy asking if I could wire some circuits into a panel from a solar panel.
He said he just wanted me to mainly terminate the wires to the breakers in the panel.

I told him I didn't really have any experience with solar, especially all the codes involved.
He said it was a stand alone system, just a few circuits he wanted to power from the solar panel. He said there would be no grid tie.
I thought maybe I could do that but thought I better question him further. So I ask again if he was going to tie into the grid.

Glad I did because he said not now, but wanted a way to transfer to the grid should he need to. I told him that opened up a different set of circumstances all together.
I think he wants to put in a transfer switch (probably ATS) at some point.

My question is, in a nut shell, what would need to be done to do this right and code compliant. I know I need to read up on the requirements in the NEC, but thought someone could point me in the right direction should I decide to do this project.

I don't think his intentions are to sell back any power, just have enough to power the few circuits he wants in a separate panel.

Or should I run from this not knowing for sure his intentions?
My feelings are he wants something done cheap, fast, and easy. Not considering what all would be involved.

My advice is to stay away from this if you don't have any solar knowledge/experience. In order to effectively and code compliantly do this work, you need to understand the whole system, and you should have more than a nodding acquaintance with NEC section 690. Does your potential customer know what he is doing, or is he just slapping some modules and an inverter together hoping it will work?

 

[Little Bill]

My advice is to stay away from this if you don't have any solar knowledge/experience. In order to effectively and code compliantly do this work, you need to understand the whole system, and you should have more than a nodding acquaintance with NEC section 690. Does your potential customer know what he is doing, or is he just slapping some modules and an inverter together hoping it will work?

My gut feeling from just talking to him on the phone and not ever meeting him, is the above in red!

 

[ggunn]

My gut feeling from just talking to him on the phone and not ever meeting him, is the above in red!

If he really is clueless and you aren't well versed enough in solar to straighten him out, run away!

 

[jaggedben]

I agree with ggunn. I've seen some Youtube videos of folks who are real proud of their home built solar setups, and I don't know whether to laugh or cry.

 

[tallgirl]

I agree with ggunn. I've seen some Youtube videos of folks who are real proud of their home built solar setups, and I don't know whether to laugh or cry.

I agree with jaggedben agreeing with ggunn.

Even if this person were completely honest in their intentions, unless you have experience with off-grid systems, and particularly with battery banks, it's best to leave them alone until you understand the unique challenges of dealing with batteries. There are some very challenging problems in dealing with battery based, or battery-backed, systems.