Adding a ground to non grounded outlets

[badashuka]

I need to add a ground to 13 receptacles in a residence. My plan is to run a 12 AWG green from panel in wall to under the house and add a couple of junction boxes. From there fish the ground up through the wall and into each receptacle location. Does anyone see a problem with this. I have referenced the NEC and have not seen anything prohibiting this. Just want to run it by the experts.

 

[rt66electric]

just as easy to run new romex

just as easy to run new romex

I would run new circuits, new romex and all. I have found the old wiring is usually fine, unless I touch it.

 

[iMuse97]

If you were to run that ground wire without any protection (ie. as part of a EMT system, or as part of a ROMEX type wiring method, it would not meet any code that I can think of. It is, after all, a wire, and wire needs to be installed in accordance with a approved wiring method. And brought into the boxes in that manner, etc. I can't tell from your post exactly what you were planning to do. But the suggestion above it a good one.

Consider that after you touch that wiring system, you are at least partially liable for the resultant system. If there is a problem, you are the one they will call. You would likely have a hard time getting yourself off that hook.

 

[badashuka]

I am not touching the existing wiring, just bringing a ground to each box

 

[Dennis Alwon]

I am not touching the existing wiring, just bringing a ground to each box

It is compliant but I too would run new wiring if possible. 250.130(C)

 

[badashuka]

Personally I prefer a rewire also but I have to stay within their budget as much as possible

 

[jxofaltrds]

I need to add a ground to 13 receptacles in a residence. My plan is to run a 12 AWG green from panel in wall to under the house and add a couple of junction boxes. From there fish the ground up through the wall and into each receptacle location. Does anyone see a problem with this. I have referenced the NEC and have not seen anything prohibiting this. Just want to run it by the experts.

Why to ALL?

It is compliant but I too would run new wiring if possible. 250.130(C)

And in addition to what Dennis said GFCIs may solve your problem.

 

[S'mise]

Yes, it is alowed by code but will take at least the same amount of time (probably more) to pull just the ground wire as pulling in a 3wire cable.

 

[jxofaltrds]

Yes, it is alowed by code but will take at least the same amount of time (probably more) to pull just the ground wire as pulling in a 3wire cable.

Disagree. In some applications like a ranch home with an unfinished basement running a egc is easier and faster than running new NM.

Not always but sometimes.

 

[growler]

It is compliant but I too would run new wiring if possible.

In some applications like a ranch home with an unfinished basement running a egc is easier and faster than running new NM.

Not always but sometimes.

I agree that running a seperate ground is code compliant but I don't think that in most cases it saves enough money to make it worth doing.

If I were to run a new ground to 13 receptacles the price difference wouldn't be that much less than to rewire the same 13 receptacles. With new wiring they shouldn't have any problems for years to come and with just a new ground there is no way of knowing ( unless they want to pay to meg the cables ) . I really don't see an advantage to just running a new ground.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

There may be a significant difference in cost (both labor and materials) and as the OP explained there is pressure to keep the cost down. Running 13 receptacles with new nm may surmount to changing out boxes and the cost difference between hundreds of feet of nm vs one solid conductor.

 

[boomer]

Adding a ground to non grounding outlets

Adding a ground to non grounding outlets

I know this is not cost effective but does article 210-7 (d) allow a gfci-type receptacle to replace the first receptacle in the circuit, and have protection? Boomer

 

[jxofaltrds]

I know this is not cost effective but does article 210-7 (d) allow a gfci-type receptacle to replace the first receptacle in the circuit, and have protection? Boomer

It is cost effective.
No 210-7(d) is not correct. It is also not in the NEC
You mean 406.4(D).
You may also use a GFCI breaker.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

Installing a gfci in place of the egc does not create an egc. It just offers protection for individuals.

 

[Buck Parrish]

If you were to run that ground wire without any protection (ie. as part of a EMT system, or as part of a ROMEX type wiring method, it would not meet any code that I can think of. It is, after all, a wire, and wire needs to be installed in accordance with a approved wiring method. And brought into the boxes in that manner, etc. I can't tell from your post exactly what you were planning to do. But the suggestion above it a good one.
.

Unless it has changed you are allowed to surface mount a #12 wire. Running it right up the wall to the outlet. It's not real pretty, but thats not the point.
Also you are/were allowed to bring it to the closest water copper pipe.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

Also you are/were allowed to bring it to the closest water copper pipe.

Not necessarily. 250.130(C) allows it to be on any accessible point on the grounding electrode system or conductor. The water pipe may not be an electrode and it is only considered an electrode to within 5' of where it enters the building. The egc is gone as soon as the plumbing is change to plastic as is often the case.

 

[JDB3]

I thought all conductors / wires of the same system / circuit had to be in the same jacket / conduit :? Hence why we can not run single conductors to a sub-panel in a residence?

 

[badashuka]

The company that I work for charges more for a rewire than a ground wire, that is why I am only grounding the outlets. I perfere to rewire the whole house.

 

[badashuka]

Unless it has changed you are allowed to surface mount a #12 wire. Running it right up the wall to the outlet. It's not real pretty, but thats not the point.
Also you are/were allowed to bring it to the closest water copper pipe.

Can you direct me to these items in the code, I would love to mark them for future reference.

And also the resident wants specifically grounded outlets not just 3 prong which is what you get with the GFCI.

Thanks to everyone who has taken the time on this topic, you guys make me a better electrician

 

[John120/240]

I thought all conductors / wires of the same system / circuit had to be in the same jacket / conduit :?

I think that refers to current carrying conductors. To counter act the EMF. I could be wrong tho.